Sack Francis Hackson and Hartley

[Rampstar]

What a lot of rot , these two have taken a list widely regarded as worse than fitzroys to a team that knocks up finals appearances like shelling peas. Me finks that might have just a liddle to do with the players incoming 

that's the difference between people like me and people like you. You like mediocrity and failure and you applaud it, you applaud finishing 7th and 8th in an 18 team comp. People like me view that as a failure, but good luck to you Bj if you like failure.

[WilliamPowell]

What a lot of rot , these two have taken a list widely regarded as worse than fitzroys to a team that knocks up finals appearances like shelling peas. Me finks that might have just a liddle to do with the players incoming 

So tell me if they've done such a great job, then why do we still have so many holes in our list; especially when you look at our list depth?

One of the problems with Hartley**** IMHO is he got certain things right when we needed to fill a specific need (eg Grigg) but the same player has now become a negative but instead of trying to upgrade on that Blair and his rating system meant said player was rewarded with a contract extension last year.

And before people start jumping up and down I will elaborate. By negative I mean that Grigg isn't going to get any better, he's been worked out by opposition and is a liability with his refusal to chase amongst other things. So (again) IMHO Hartley should be looking to upgrade on this not rely on it as the objective should be about constant improvement to enable the club to get better to become a contender rather than a far away challenger. He hasn't done that so IMV that's is the weakness in what he is doing

The Hampson situation is going to be what he is remembered for because that is a terrible decision that we are now stuck with for another 2 years, that shackle isn't going anywhere

 



***And yes I am on record as saying I don't rate him and I am not a fan***

[bojangles17]

That's actually more a fault of dimma in opening up opportunities for others to take that spot, there are a few that were denied a decent crack at it.
Gordon has proved to be a good selection , we have Mcbean about to come in.
The yield from our rookie list in 2014 has no peer. Miles and Thomas , senior games played.
These guys know their stuff

[Rampstar]

That's actually more a fault of dimma in opening up opportunities for others to take that spot, there are a few that were denied a decent crack at it.
Gordon has proved to be a good selection , we have Mcbean about to come in.
The yield from our rookie list in 2014 has no peer. Miles and Thomas , senior games played.
These guys know their stuff

quoted for the comedic value 

McBean was Jacksons pic from the draft. Thomas is a d grade player average at best, slow who I and many others don't rate. Gordon aint that good to be honest just filling a hole until we draft in a replacement. That doesn't leave a lot of your arguments standing Bj ... just shows how ordinary its all been.

[tony_montana]

I think you're all correct to an extent - willyp and ramps about Grigg being a good selection early on, but now become a negative bc we haven't upgraded again - also that we shouldn't be happy with where we are and really need to get hungry now as a club to take the next step.

BJ is also correct in that Dimma also should wear the blame with the lack of opportunities he gives young players to displace their older peers. Shane Edwards was given 8 weeks this year, Grigg & Newman haven't deserved a game for yrs, on the otherhand

 Dea 2 bad games out, Arnott 1 bad game out, O'Hanlon 20 mins out.

[Diocletian]

I don't know why anyone even bothers trying to engage Bo in serious football discussion when he's clearly a troll.

[Gigantor]

Bo loves his tigers..he has a special fondness for the black and yellow whether they be snakes or tigers

[bojangles17]

What a lot of rot , these two have taken a list widely regarded as worse than fitzroys to a team that knocks up finals appearances like shelling peas. Me finks that might have just a liddle to do with the players incoming 

that's the difference between people like me and people like you. You like mediocrity and failure and you applaud it, you applaud finishing 7th and 8th in an 18 team comp. People like me view that as a failure, but good luck to you Bj if you like failure.

u wouldn't know poo ramp, I compete for a living, I don't know mediocrity or failure , im at the top of my game nice try though, teeth back in and brain into gear and reload 

[Rampstar]

What a lot of rot , these two have taken a list widely regarded as worse than fitzroys to a team that knocks up finals appearances like shelling peas. Me finks that might have just a liddle to do with the players incoming 

that's the difference between people like me and people like you. You like mediocrity and failure and you applaud it, you applaud finishing 7th and 8th in an 18 team comp. People like me view that as a failure, but good luck to you Bj if you like failure.

u wouldn't know poo ramp, I compete for a living, I don't know mediocrity or failure , im at the top of my game nice try though, teeth back in and brain into gear and reload 

Only took you 3 hours to come up with a response. You should get a job working in the Labor Party or the Unions 

[tdy]

The problem is that we need to actually add to our recruiters not get rid of them. I'd also look at getting the Geelong guy to take over as head recruiter.

Serious question what do you think is the right number?

We have what full time 4 recruiters - Jackson, Taylor, Clarke and Williams plus (assuming here) a couple of part-time scouts interstate

How many more do we need, forget whether who have should go or not just talking pure numbers?

On the collingwood web site they have 4 full timers and they sacked on i  jan this year Noel Judkins which they may or may not have replaced.  Thy have 10 coaches and 4 football analysts.  I think a case could be made that analysts have input into the recruiting as do coaches but its the full timers that prob do the most heavy lifting in recruiting. 

The AFL integrity dept this year cracked down on part time recruiting staff.  Fron this we might see how many they really do have.  I read ages ago they had 9 but how true that is I dont know.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-integrity-crackdown-spreads-to-parttime-recruiting-scouts-20140323-hvltd.html

[WilliamPowell]

That's actually more a fault of dimma in opening up opportunities for others to take that spot, there are a few that were denied a decent crack at it.
Gordon has proved to be a good selection , we have Mcbean about to come in.
The yield from our rookie list in 2014 has no peer. Miles and Thomas , senior games played.
These guys know their stuff

Agree that when it comes to Dimma and the selection group they did not give opportunities to kids that should have been given them

 But and this is my point Dimma isn't the one who said Griig is worth another 3 years, that was Blair Hartley. They may have all agreed we needed another ruckman but Dimma didn't say let's get Hampson, that was Blair and his rating system. And not only did we over pay at the trade table we gave him 3 years! If that's "knowing their stuff" I'd rather have pre-schoolers making the deal using pin the tail on the donkey as their method of evaluation

I think people would be staggered at how much input good 'ole Blair has in contracts discussions with current blokes on our list and on the blokes he recommends we trade for. IMV he has far too much say and the proof is IMHO there for everyone to see in 2014

And Please don't say our rookie selections were brilliant this year. Miles is the expection, Thomas isn't someone you would want to hang your hat on and Banfield last time I checked he got de-listed this week. Ditto 2 other rookies. Don't think we can boast our "rookie list has no peer"

Blair Hartley has got a couple of things right but he has made some monumental mistakes that are going to be biting us for a few more years yet

[YellowandBlackBlood]

That's actually more a fault of dimma in opening up opportunities for others to take that spot, there are a few that were denied a decent crack at it.
Gordon has proved to be a good selection , we have Mcbean about to come in.
The yield from our rookie list in 2014 has no peer. Miles and Thomas , senior games played.
These guys know their stuff

Agree that when it comes to Dimma and the selection group they did not give opportunities to kids that should have been given them

 But and this is my point Dimma isn't the one who said Griig is worth another 3 years, that was Blair Hartley. They may have all agreed we needed another ruckman but Dimma didn't say let's get Hampson, that was Blair and his rating system. And not only did we over pay at the trade table we gave him 3 years! If that's "knowing their stuff" I'd rather have pre-schoolers making the deal using pin the tail on the donkey as their method of evaluation

I think people would be staggered at how much input good 'ole Blair has in contracts discussions with current blokes on our list and on the blokes he recommends we trade for. IMV he has far too much say and the proof is IMHO there for everyone to see in 2014

And Please don't say our rookie selections were brilliant this year. Miles is the expection, Thomas isn't someone you would want to hang your hat on and Banfield last time I checked he got de-listed this week. Ditto 2 other rookies. Don't think we can boast our "rookie list has no peer"

Blair Hartley has got a couple of things right but he has made some monumental mistakes that are going to be biting us for a few more years yet

[bojangles17]

That's actually more a fault of dimma in opening up opportunities for others to take that spot, there are a few that were denied a decent crack at it.
Gordon has proved to be a good selection , we have Mcbean about to come in.
The yield from our rookie list in 2014 has no peer. Miles and Thomas , senior games played.
These guys know their stuff

Agree that when it comes to Dimma and the selection group they did not give opportunities to kids that should have been given them

 But and this is my point Dimma isn't the one who said Griig is worth another 3 years, that was Blair Hartley. They may have all agreed we needed another ruckman but Dimma didn't say let's get Hampson, that was Blair and his rating system. And not only did we over pay at the trade table we gave him 3 years! If that's "knowing their stuff" I'd rather have pre-schoolers making the deal using pin the tail on the donkey as their method of evaluation

I think people would be staggered at how much input good 'ole Blair has in contracts discussions with current blokes on our list and on the blokes he recommends we trade for. IMV he has far too much say and the proof is IMHO there for everyone to see in 2014

And Please don't say our rookie selections were brilliant this year. Miles is the expection, Thomas isn't someone you would want to hang your hat on and Banfield last time I checked he got de-listed this week. Ditto 2 other rookies. Don't think we can boast our "rookie list has no peer"

Blair Hartley has got a couple of things right but he has made some monumental mistakes that are going to be biting us for a few more years yet

You can't hang a bloke on one decision, are u going to say hawthorn are idiots coz they stuffed up on dayle garlett or collingwood are idiots for Quentin lynch and the big dud from Sydney . It's gotta be a balanced view and these guys have improved our list from a very low base

[YellowandBlackBlood]

That's actually more a fault of dimma in opening up opportunities for others to take that spot, there are a few that were denied a decent crack at it.
Gordon has proved to be a good selection , we have Mcbean about to come in.
The yield from our rookie list in 2014 has no peer. Miles and Thomas , senior games played.
These guys know their stuff

Agree that when it comes to Dimma and the selection group they did not give opportunities to kids that should have been given them

 But and this is my point Dimma isn't the one who said Griig is worth another 3 years, that was Blair Hartley. They may have all agreed we needed another ruckman but Dimma didn't say let's get Hampson, that was Blair and his rating system. And not only did we over pay at the trade table we gave him 3 years! If that's "knowing their stuff" I'd rather have pre-schoolers making the deal using pin the tail on the donkey as their method of evaluation

I think people would be staggered at how much input good 'ole Blair has in contracts discussions with current blokes on our list and on the blokes he recommends we trade for. IMV he has far too much say and the proof is IMHO there for everyone to see in 2014

And Please don't say our rookie selections were brilliant this year. Miles is the expection, Thomas isn't someone you would want to hang your hat on and Banfield last time I checked he got de-listed this week. Ditto 2 other rookies. Don't think we can boast our "rookie list has no peer"

Blair Hartley has got a couple of things right but he has made some monumental mistakes that are going to be biting us for a few more years yet

You can't hang a bloke on one decision, are u going to say hawthorn are idiots coz they stuffed up on dayle garlett or collingwood are idiots for Quentin lynch and the big dud from Sydney . It's gotta be a balanced view and these guys have improved our list from a very low base

They have not taken enough risks with youth (especially last year).

[bojangles17]

I don't know why anyone even bothers trying to engage Bo in serious football discussion when he's clearly a troll.

Lol, genius