NAB 3: Richmond vs Port Adelaide @ Etihad

[WilliamPowell]

I know what the medal is actually called, I have mentioned it before.

Yes McBean does have more runs on the board in high level competitive football - considerably more. VFL premiership matches are far more competitive than early NAB challenge matches where no-one is match fit yet, the sides aren't full strength, most players aren't going at anything  close to 100%, players are often played out of position and everyone is trying to avoid injuries. McBean's played over 40 of the former , Chol's played only two of the latter.

McBean's goal tally has been up there with the best in the comp. each year despite each year being interrupted by injury and/or senior selection and him playing less matches than his main rivals - the VFL season is only 18 matches long to start with. He's also done this in a bottom 4 side with abysmal delivery from a sub-standard midfield often on dung heaps, in appalling conditions - not the MCG on a nice, mild sunny afternoon or Etihad with the roof closed, receiving lace outs on the tit from Deledio & Martin.

I know what his strengths & weaknesses are, I've seen plenty of him live and close -up but again, your assertion that a kid who's played only two hit & giggle practice matches so far has already gone past him - effectively saying he's a better, more proven player is frankly, absurd.

Reminds me of some of the reactions to Tambling after his first NAB Cup.

Then why hasnt he played any NAB games? And dont just says it's because Hardwick has no idea

There has to be more to it than that if he isn't injured. 

And by all reports he isnt so why have they preferred Chol over him. Especially this week when you'd most likely only be playing blokes likely for round 1

[Stalin]

They prefer Chaplin over him FFs

They hve no idea is a fairy sound argument

[Diocletian]

I know what the medal is actually called, I have mentioned it before.

Yes McBean does have more runs on the board in high level competitive football - considerably more. VFL premiership matches are far more competitive than early NAB challenge matches where no-one is match fit yet, the sides aren't full strength, most players aren't going at anything  close to 100%, players are often played out of position and everyone is trying to avoid injuries. McBean's played over 40 of the former , Chol's played only two of the latter.

McBean's goal tally has been up there with the best in the comp. each year despite each year being interrupted by injury and/or senior selection and him playing less matches than his main rivals - the VFL season is only 18 matches long to start with. He's also done this in a bottom 4 side with abysmal delivery from a sub-standard midfield often on dung heaps, in appalling conditions - not the MCG on a nice, mild sunny afternoon or Etihad with the roof closed, receiving lace outs on the tit from Deledio & Martin.

I know what his strengths & weaknesses are, I've seen plenty of him live and close -up but again, your assertion that a kid who's played only two hit & giggle practice matches so far has already gone past him - effectively saying he's a better, more proven player is frankly, absurd.

Reminds me of some of the reactions to Tambling after his first NAB Cup.

Then why hasnt he played any NAB games? And dont just says it's because Hardwick has no idea

There has to be more to it than that if he isn't injured. 

And by all reports he isnt so why have they preferred Chol over him. Especially this week when you'd most likely only be playing blokes likely for round 1

So that proves beyond a doubt he's that already a better player right now? Before he's even played a competitive match? Ok, if you say so.....

I'll concede he's a better ruck prospect than McBean, but I've never really considered McBean a ruckman or anything more than a back up ruck at best....and given our current paucity of genuine rucks, particularly high leaping rucks....I'd say that's a lot to do with why Choi's being given a run atm...

BTW - If he plays mostly VFL this year , primarily as a forward, how many goals would you expect him to kick? By your standards, I'd imagine at least 50..should pee in the Frosty Miller....

They prefer Chaplin over him FFs

They have no idea is a fairly sound argument

Exactly.

[big tone]

My honest answer is I don't know. Is McBean injured?

I don't think so because he was named in the NAB 2 squad, so unless an injury has happened since then, the answer would appear no

Anyway I don't ever see McBean as a ruckman,

Why's that big tone?

Body shape? Not enough strength?

IMV in 3 years he doesn't appear to have added any bulk (especially across the shoulders) so I agree unless he can do that he's not a ruck option. But I would think it would also limit him in his ability to take contested marks. Get your point about being a lead up forward but there will always be times he needs to compete and clunk a few contested marks

Interested in your thoughts

I guess why I don't see him as a genuine ruckman is simple he doesn't have the size (not height) or the leap to compete with the genuine ruckman of the comp.
I see him as a 3rd tall forward option in the Gunston mould. Not as good obviously.....yet,  but in the roaming, hard to match up on, smart, reliable shot in goal type of mould.
I think his overhead marking is better than some might think too, not Richo like but decent.
I think if we need a genuine ruckman to replace Maric, we should draft one or more so trade for an established one. The ex WCE and now Swan Sinclair would have been ideal IMO. 
Anyway not playing him if not injured in these practice games is just stupid. Really stupid.

[WilliamPowell]

So that proves beyond a doubt he's that already a better player right now? Before he's even played a competitive match? Ok, if you say so.....

I don't say so, it just raises an interesting question as to why Chol's getting the nod before McBean. I'm just interested in people's views

Throw in the fact for NAB 2, neither Vickery or Griffiths were available and McBean still get a call up; just begs the question why. And the argument that they played Chaplin instead is in a way flawed because in NAB 1, they played Vickery, Chaplin, Chol, Griffiths

I'll concede he's a better ruck prospect than McBean, but I've never really considered McBean a ruckman or anything more than a back up ruck at best....and given our current paucity of genuine rucks, particularly high leaping rucks....I'd say that's a lot to do with why Choi's being given a run atm...

 

Interesting you say (like big tone does) that you don't see him as a ruckman. It appears not many people do. I didn't follow him at all as junior but did he play as ruckman in the TAC Cup? Reason I ask is because I thought we actually drafted him to develop him as ruckman...

BTW - If he plays mostly VFL this year , primarily as a forward, how many goals would you expect him to kick? By your standards, I'd imagine at least 50..should pee in the Frosty Miller....

I'd hope if he stays injury free and plays mainly in the VFL I think 60-70 goals is a good return

[Heart of Darkness]

There's simply no way that it can be argued Chol is ahead of McBean based of 2 NAB games. McBean looked ok in actual H & A games and has been dominant at times in the VFL. Chol showed a few moments of promise (whilst still looking miles away in my assessment) in practice matches.

McBean isn't playing because there must be something in his game/ character that Dimma doesn't like at the moment. We've seen enough of Dimma to know he has a stubborn streak and will play blokes he likes at the expense of those who deserve it more.

McBean may not make it in the end but if Chol gets a game ahead of him early this year i think there'd be a lot of people justifiably mystified. 

[WilliamPowell]

I guess why I don't see him as a genuine ruckman is simple he doesn't have the size (not height) or the leap to compete with the genuine ruckman of the comp.
I see him as a 3rd tall forward option in the Gunston mould. Not as good obviously.....yet,  but in the roaming, hard to match up on, smart, reliable shot in goal type of mould.
I think his overhead marking is better than some might think too, not Richo like but decent.
I think if we need a genuine ruckman to replace Maric, we should draft one or more so trade for an established one. The ex WCE and now Swan Sinclair would have been ideal IMO. 
Anyway not playing him if not injured in these practice games is just stupid. Really stupid.

Thanks 

[the claw]

My honest answer is I don't know. Is McBean injured?

I don't think so because he was named in the NAB 2 squad, so unless an injury has happened since then, the answer would appear no

Anyway I don't ever see McBean as a ruckman,

Why's that big tone?

Body shape? Not enough strength?

IMV in 3 years he doesn't appear to have added any bulk (especially across the shoulders) so I agree unless he can do that he's not a ruck option. But I would think it would also limit him in his ability to take contested marks. Get your point about being a lead up forward but there will always be times he needs to compete and clunk a few contested marks

Interested in your thoughts

I guess why I don't see him as a genuine ruckman is simple he doesn't have the size (not height) or the leap to compete with the genuine ruckman of the comp.
I see him as a 3rd tall forward option in the Gunston mould. Not as good obviously.....yet,  but in the roaming, hard to match up on, smart, reliable shot in goal type of mould.
I think his overhead marking is better than some might think too, not Richo like but decent.
I think if we need a genuine ruckman to replace Maric, we should draft one or more so trade for an established one. The ex WCE and now Swan Sinclair would have been ideal IMO. 
Anyway not playing him if not injured in these practice games is just stupid. Really stupid.

Your talking a westhoff type. I still think he should be tried as a chb where his inability to clunk marks is made null and void by the simple fact all he needs to do is spoil.
Any way the club have constantly said they took him to be a long term ruck man.They continually play him as a fwd because of his lack of size.

[big tone]

My honest answer is I don't know. Is McBean injured?

I don't think so because he was named in the NAB 2 squad, so unless an injury has happened since then, the answer would appear no

Anyway I don't ever see McBean as a ruckman,

Why's that big tone?

Body shape? Not enough strength?

IMV in 3 years he doesn't appear to have added any bulk (especially across the shoulders) so I agree unless he can do that he's not a ruck option. But I would think it would also limit him in his ability to take contested marks. Get your point about being a lead up forward but there will always be times he needs to compete and clunk a few contested marks

Interested in your thoughts

I guess why I don't see him as a genuine ruckman is simple he doesn't have the size (not height) or the leap to compete with the genuine ruckman of the comp.
I see him as a 3rd tall forward option in the Gunston mould. Not as good obviously.....yet,  but in the roaming, hard to match up on, smart, reliable shot in goal type of mould.
I think his overhead marking is better than some might think too, not Richo like but decent.
I think if we need a genuine ruckman to replace Maric, we should draft one or more so trade for an established one. The ex WCE and now Swan Sinclair would have been ideal IMO. 
Anyway not playing him if not injured in these practice games is just stupid. Really stupid.

Your talking a westhoff type. I still think he should be tried as a chb where his inability to clunk marks is made null and void by the simple fact all he needs to do is spoil.
Any way the club have constantly said they took him to be a long term ruck man.They continually play him as a fwd because of his lack of size.

Actually Westoff is a perfect example type.
I guess the Gunston comparison was a bit of wishful thinking.

I'll tell you a quick storey about Jack Gunston. My wife is best friends with his cousin and we have been to weddings and famiily holidays in Barwon Heads when he has been there.
But before he was traded to Hawthorn from Adelaide I would joke to his cousin that if she convinced him to come to Tigerland I'd come around and mow his lawns for him. It's a bit of a running joke now with us but I could just tell he was going to be a pretty special player even from the 20 odd games he played for Adelaide.
The one thing they always laugh at when it comes up now is that they say he made the right decision. 

[🏅Dooks]

So that proves beyond a doubt he's that already a better player right now? Before he's even played a competitive match? Ok, if you say so.....

I don't say so, it just raises an interesting question as to why Chol's getting the nod before McBean. I'm just interested in people's views

Throw in the fact for NAB 2, neither Vickery or Griffiths were available and McBean still get a call up; just begs the question why. And the argument that they played Chaplin instead is in a way flawed because in NAB 1, they played Vickery, Chaplin, Chol, Griffiths

I'll concede he's a better ruck prospect than McBean, but I've never really considered McBean a ruckman or anything more than a back up ruck at best....and given our current paucity of genuine rucks, particularly high leaping rucks....I'd say that's a lot to do with why Choi's being given a run atm...

 

Interesting you say (like big tone does) that you don't see him as a ruckman. It appears not many people do. I didn't follow him at all as junior but did he play as ruckman in the TAC Cup? Reason I ask is because I thought we actually drafted him to develop him as ruckman...

BTW - If he plays mostly VFL this year , primarily as a forward, how many goals would you expect him to kick? By your standards, I'd imagine at least 50..should pee in the Frosty Miller....

I'd hope if he stays injury free and plays mainly in the VFL I think 60-70 goals is a good return

With regard to TAC cup, he rarely played ruck. Was known to not like rucking front on contests (centre bounces) and hence never developed this as part of his gamr

[the claw]

So that proves beyond a doubt he's that already a better player right now? Before he's even played a competitive match? Ok, if you say so.....

I don't say so, it just raises an interesting question as to why Chol's getting the nod before McBean. I'm just interested in people's views

Throw in the fact for NAB 2, neither Vickery or Griffiths were available and McBean still get a call up; just begs the question why. And the argument that they played Chaplin instead is in a way flawed because in NAB 1, they played Vickery, Chaplin, Chol, Griffiths

I'll concede he's a better ruck prospect than McBean, but I've never really considered McBean a ruckman or anything more than a back up ruck at best....and given our current paucity of genuine rucks, particularly high leaping rucks....I'd say that's a lot to do with why Choi's being given a run atm...

 

Interesting you say (like big tone does) that you don't see him as a ruckman. It appears not many people do. I didn't follow him at all as junior but did he play as ruckman in the TAC Cup? Reason I ask is because I thought we actually drafted him to develop him as ruckman...

BTW - If he plays mostly VFL this year , primarily as a forward, how many goals would you expect him to kick? By your standards, I'd imagine at least 50..should pee in the Frosty Miller....

I'd hope if he stays injury free and plays mainly in the VFL I think 60-70 goals is a good return

With regard to TAC cup, he rarely played ruck. Was known to not like rucking front on contests (centre bounces) and hence never developed this as part of his gamr

So why has the club consistently said they see him as a ruckman long term.I have a good idea why but i would like to hear it from someone else first.
In regard ruck contests we could have been talking about Vickery.

[Petey]

They haven't said they see him as a ruckman ffs

[Penelope]

more made up stuff.

[YellowandBlackBlood]

I can only find one comment about McBean and rucking from Dan Richardson.
“And, then, we’ve obviously got the likes of Ty (Vickery) and ‘Griff’ (Ben Griffiths), and even Liam McBean, who can pinch hit in the ruck too.”
http://www.richmondfc.com.au/news/2015-11-23/no-rucking-issue-for-tigers

[the claw]

more made up stuff.

Lol more innuendo you still sooking .