Rumoured leadership group - Cotch (c), Rance, Titch, Jack (H-Sun)

[Damo]

I'm surpirised Hampson isn't in it.

He leads by example at training

Spiritual leader

[WA Tiger]

Maybe Batchelor and Morris this year would have been better, oh and throw Tich in too.

[one-eyed]

KB's Take | Why haven't Tiger teammates rated Jack?

By Kevin Bartlett
SEN
Feb 9, 2017

Jack Riewoldt hasn’t been in Richmond’s leadership group for three years.

That has been a great mystery for those outside the Richmond Football Club.

What is it about the club’s Jack Dyer and Coleman Medal winner and seven times leading goal kicker that has team mates offside so much, that they dumped him back in 2014.

It’s always puzzled me that the star forward and match winner, who along with Trent Cotchin and the now departed Brett Deledio, made up the big three at Tigerland did not have the qualities whatever they were to win the confidence of the playing group.

New assistant coach Justin Leppitsch sings Riewoldt’s praises during this pre-season. He calls him a great leader who drives the club and says he is well respected as the most experienced forward at Punt Road.

That’s what has me scratching my head. Because the players clearly have never thought that.

2017 is a crunch year for the Tigers. Coach Damien Hardwick is under scrutiny, Deledio packed up and went to GWS, Dustin Martin has put contract talks on hold and outside groups have shown their agitation.

So the club has to get everything right in 2017 and the on-field leadership will be critical.

Leppitsch says in Riewoldt. Now it’s over to the players.

I’m KB, that’s my take.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2017/02/06/kbs-take-or-why-havent-tiger-teammates-rated-jack/

[big tone]

Does anyone actually think the players have a decent say on who is captain or even who is in the leadership group?
I don't.
I think there is a vote, and then the coach and coaching group put whoever they want in the leadership group. How would anyone know any better??

From what I've heard in previous years Cotch wouldn't have been the captain if it were up to the playing group.

Anyway just my opinion.

[WilliamPowell]

Does anyone actually think the players have a decent say on who is captain or even who is in the leadership group?
I don't.
I think there is a vote, and then the coach and coaching group put whoever they want in the leadership group. How would anyone know any better??

From what I've heard in previous years Cotch wouldn't have been the captain if it were up to the playing group.

Anyway just my opinion.

I do actually.

Players most definitely elect the leadership group and vote on the captain. Have heard this from a few players over the years

Coaches also vote and recommend to the board who ratify (most clubs have the appointment rstifeid by the board)

Having said that ultimately the coach has the most say. That's why I reckon Cotchin will remain captain. Hardwick has already said as far as he's concerned Cotchin will be captain in 2017

But the leadership group is voted on by the playing group

[big tone]

Does anyone actually think the players have a decent say on who is captain or even who is in the leadership group?
I don't.
I think there is a vote, and then the coach and coaching group put whoever they want in the leadership group. How would anyone know any better??

From what I've heard in previous years Cotch wouldn't have been the captain if it were up to the playing group.

Anyway just my opinion.

I do actually.

Players most definitely elect the leadership group and vote on the captain. Have heard this from a few players over the years

Coaches also vote and recommend to the board who ratify (most clubs have the appointment rstifeid by the board)

Having said that ultimately the coach has the most say. That's why I reckon Cotchin will remain captain. Hardwick has already said as far as he's concerned Cotchin will be captain in 2017

But the leadership group is voted on by the playing group

I know the players vote but as I said, who would know what the results were other than Dimma and maybe his assistants. If the players actually had a say Jack would have been in the leadership group the last couple of years IMO.

[WilliamPowell]

Does anyone actually think the players have a decent say on who is captain or even who is in the leadership group?
I don't.
I think there is a vote, and then the coach and coaching group put whoever they want in the leadership group. How would anyone know any better??

From what I've heard in previous years Cotch wouldn't have been the captain if it were up to the playing group.

Anyway just my opinion.

I do actually.

Players most definitely elect the leadership group and vote on the captain. Have heard this from a few players over the years

Coaches also vote and recommend to the board who ratify (most clubs have the appointment rstifeid by the board)

Having said that ultimately the coach has the most say. That's why I reckon Cotchin will remain captain. Hardwick has already said as far as he's concerned Cotchin will be captain in 2017

But the leadership group is voted on by the playing group

I know the players vote but as I said, who would know what the results were other than Dimma and maybe his assistants. If the players actually had a say Jack would have been in the leadership group the last couple of years IMO.

Players voted him out 2 seasons ago. Staggering I know but it is what happened

[big tone]

Does anyone actually think the players have a decent say on who is captain or even who is in the leadership group?
I don't.
I think there is a vote, and then the coach and coaching group put whoever they want in the leadership group. How would anyone know any better??

From what I've heard in previous years Cotch wouldn't have been the captain if it were up to the playing group.

Anyway just my opinion.

I do actually.

Players most definitely elect the leadership group and vote on the captain. Have heard this from a few players over the years

Coaches also vote and recommend to the board who ratify (most clubs have the appointment rstifeid by the board)

Having said that ultimately the coach has the most say. That's why I reckon Cotchin will remain captain. Hardwick has already said as far as he's concerned Cotchin will be captain in 2017

But the leadership group is voted on by the playing group

I know the players vote but as I said, who would know what the results were other than Dimma and maybe his assistants. If the players actually had a say Jack would have been in the leadership group the last couple of years IMO.

Players voted him out 2 seasons ago. Staggering I know but it is what happened

This is what I find really annoying about you WP. What you know to have happened is only what someone has told you. And as I've said TWICE, Dimma can say whatever he likes, and choose whom ever he likes as no one will ever know the true result of the vote.
If you had said, this is my opinion,  I would accept that but you are always so "matter of fact" like you are the only one that really knows anything that happens at the club.
Tha facts are you don't really know if the players voted Jack out or not.

[YellowandBlackBlood]

I have to disagree with you big tone. I know nobody knows what really happens but there are a few points that indicate that what you say is very unlikely.

Firstly, why would the club go through the charade of having a players vote only to veto the whole process and have the coach and coaching group select the leadership group? Why not just say that the coach and coaching group will select the leadership group and just leave it at that?

Secondly, don't you think that the players would get suspicious? Wouldn't you think that many of them talk with one another about their thoughts? If several of them said to each other they picked Jack and he wasn't selected, wouldn't you think that eventually that would get out? The damage that would create would be enormous. Why would the club take the chance?

[Hard Roar Tiger]

I have to disagree with you big tone. I know nobody knows what really happens but there are a few points that indicate that what you say is very unlikely.

Firstly, why would the club go through the charade of having a players vote only to veto the whole process and have the coach and coaching group select the leadership group? Why not just say that the coach and coaching group will select the leadership group and just leave it at that?

Secondly, don't you think that the players would get suspicious? Wouldn't you think that many of them talk with one another about their thoughts? If several of them said to each other they picked Jack and he wasn't selected, wouldn't you think that eventually that would get out? The damage that would create would be enormous. Why would the club take the chance?

WP mentioned the coach has the biggest say on voting the captain (which is clearly the most important role in the leadership group) and the board have veto rights (they have to ratify) so at face value, based on WP's intel - the players vote is only one part of the process and somewhat open to veto. Even if you accept that it's only the captaincy which Dimma has the most say, imagine if the players voted Cotchin out of the leadership group and Dimma still kept him as captain - based on WPs assertion, that's possible which is ridiculous.
Having said that BTS point seems more linked to WP posting assertions which come across as fact without quoting sources which to BT comes across as a double standard. As this seems to be his point, what aspect of that are you disagreeing with?

[WilliamPowell]

This is what I find really annoying about you WP. What you know to have happened is only what someone has told you. And as I've said TWICE, Dimma can say whatever he likes, and choose whom ever he likes as no one will ever know the true result of the vote.
If you had said, this is my opinion,  I would accept that but you are always so "matter of fact" like you are the only one that really knows anything that happens at the club.
Tha facts are you don't really know if the players voted Jack out or not.

So I get told the same thing by a number of people not one person a number of people and I have to preface t but saying it's just my opinion. 

Fact up until about 6 months ago the club's leadership program was run by a third party called Leading Teams; this isn't hearsay it is as I said fact.

Club flicked them; been reported in the media. Why were they flicked? Who knows?

Anyway as part of the leading Teams running the leadership program they are the people who conduct the vote. A number of people have told me that the votes go to them they count them and the announce them. they have said that's how it works.

Even someone I know who follows another club that uses Leading teams told me the same thing

So in my opinion having been told the same thing by a number of people in that a 3rd party has in the past conducted the voting process it would be extremely difficult for one individual to change the result

[YellowandBlackBlood]

I have to disagree with you big tone. I know nobody knows what really happens but there are a few points that indicate that what you say is very unlikely.

Firstly, why would the club go through the charade of having a players vote only to veto the whole process and have the coach and coaching group select the leadership group? Why not just say that the coach and coaching group will select the leadership group and just leave it at that?

Secondly, don't you think that the players would get suspicious? Wouldn't you think that many of them talk with one another about their thoughts? If several of them said to each other they picked Jack and he wasn't selected, wouldn't you think that eventually that would get out? The damage that would create would be enormous. Why would the club take the chance?

WP mentioned the coach has the biggest say on voting the captain (which is clearly the most important role in the leadership group) and the board have veto rights (they have to ratify) so at face value, based on WP's intel - the players vote is only one part of the process and somewhat open to veto. Even if you accept that it's only the captaincy which Dimma has the most say, imagine if the players voted Cotchin out of the leadership group and Dimma still kept him as captain - based on WPs assertion, that's possible which is ridiculous.
Having said that BTS point seems more linked to WP posting assertions which come across as fact without quoting sources which to BT comes across as a double standard. As this seems to be his point, what aspect of that are you disagreeing with?

This quote:
"I think there is a vote, and then the coach and coaching group put whoever they want in the leadership group. How would anyone know any better??"

[Chuck17]

This is what I find really annoying about you WP. What you know to have happened is only what someone has told you. And as I've said TWICE, Dimma can say whatever he likes, and choose whom ever he likes as no one will ever know the true result of the vote.
If you had said, this is my opinion,  I would accept that but you are always so "matter of fact" like you are the only one that really knows anything that happens at the club.
Tha facts are you don't really know if the players voted Jack out or not.

So I get told the same thing by a number of people not one person a number of people and I have to preface t but saying it's just my opinion. 

Fact up until about 6 months ago the club's leadership program was run by a third party called Leading Teams; this isn't hearsay it is as I said fact.

Club flicked them; been reported in the media. Why were they flicked? Who knows?

Anyway as part of the leading Teams running the leadership program they are the people who conduct the vote. A number of people have told me that the votes go to them they count them and the announce them. they have said that's how it works.

Even someone I know who follows another club that uses Leading teams told me the same thing

So in my opinion having been told the same thing by a number of people in that a 3rd party has in the past conducted the voting process it would be extremely difficult for one individual to change the result

You are wasting your breath WP, some fools see cloak and daggers by making their own shadows

[big tone]

This is what I find really annoying about you WP. What you know to have happened is only what someone has told you. And as I've said TWICE, Dimma can say whatever he likes, and choose whom ever he likes as no one will ever know the true result of the vote.
If you had said, this is my opinion,  I would accept that but you are always so "matter of fact" like you are the only one that really knows anything that happens at the club.
Tha facts are you don't really know if the players voted Jack out or not.

So I get told the same thing by a number of people not one person a number of people and I have to preface t but saying it's just my opinion. 

Fact up until about 6 months ago the club's leadership program was run by a third party called Leading Teams; this isn't hearsay it is as I said fact.

Club flicked them; been reported in the media. Why were they flicked? Who knows?

Anyway as part of the leading Teams running the leadership program they are the people who conduct the vote. A number of people have told me that the votes go to them they count them and the announce them. they have said that's how it works.

Even someone I know who follows another club that uses Leading teams told me the same thing

So in my opinion having been told the same thing by a number of people in that a 3rd party has in the past conducted the voting process it would be extremely difficult for one individual to change the result

You are wasting your breath WP, some fools see cloak and daggers by making their own shadows

Old Chunky to the rescue. I'm sure WP can fight his own battles.
Another useless post but thanks for your "cloak and dagger" input. Really glad I wasted my time reading that.
Here is a tip for free, try and contribute something decent once in a while. It makes it so much more interesting for the other forum members. I suppose I should be thankful it wasn't one of your pathetically boring and unfunny jokes. 

[big tone]

This is what I find really annoying about you WP. What you know to have happened is only what someone has told you. And as I've said TWICE, Dimma can say whatever he likes, and choose whom ever he likes as no one will ever know the true result of the vote.
If you had said, this is my opinion,  I would accept that but you are always so "matter of fact" like you are the only one that really knows anything that happens at the club.
Tha facts are you don't really know if the players voted Jack out or not.

So I get told the same thing by a number of people not one person a number of people and I have to preface t but saying it's just my opinion. 

Fact up until about 6 months ago the club's leadership program was run by a third party called Leading Teams; this isn't hearsay it is as I said fact.

Club flicked them; been reported in the media. Why were they flicked? Who knows?

Anyway as part of the leading Teams running the leadership program they are the people who conduct the vote. A number of people have told me that the votes go to them they count them and the announce them. they have said that's how it works.

Even someone I know who follows another club that uses Leading teams told me the same thing

So in my opinion having been told the same thing by a number of people in that a 3rd party has in the past conducted the voting process it would be extremely difficult for one individual to change the result

The reason I question the system WP is because I've heard something in the past that makes me think it's not all above board. Nothing I would be comfortable sharing but I too heard it from someone inside the club at the time. He was wearing a cloak and did have a dagger but I definitely think what he was saying was fact.