Can Richmond challenge again in 2023?

[the claw]

2023 just isn’t Richmond’s year

Nathan Buckley
SEN
17 April 2023

“I think the supporters and everyone else need to readjust our expectations of them.

“I think they’ve been coached exceptionally well. I think they’ve been true to themselves, the messaging would be really consistent about the way they want them to play.

“But in the last eight quarters, they’ve kicked 15 goals in two of those quarters, and only eight goals in the other six.

“There’s a big difference between their capacity to score when they execute their kicking or their handball or their simple basics in the game, and when they don’t.

“They’ve just got kids playing that aren’t ready to play in winning teams. That’s not to say they’re not having a go, but there’s just too many of them. (Noah) Cumberland, (Tylar) Young, Maurice Rioli, (Tyler) Sonsie, (Rhyan) Mansell, (Samson) Ryan, (Brad) Miller, (Hugo) Ralphsmith, (Judson) Clarke all played in the side on the weekend. All have got talent and things they can offer the team but there’s just too many at once.

“I don’t think it’s an excuse at all, but I think that the way that Richmond went into this season, their top half looked amazing, they recruited (Tim) Taranto and (Jacob) Hopper, they brought in some players, tried to address a need through the midfield and there’s no doubt they have done that.

“But they’ve just lost too many of their players that they’ve relied on and some of their experienced players have dropped off before they thought they would.

“The expectations need to shift. Damien Hardwick isn’t coaching for success this year, his language has changed slightly. The leaders in the side need to make that adjustment as well because I saw an element of frustration in the way they went about it on the weekend.

“If they continue not to deal with or understand the reality of the situation that they’re in, then that frustration will continue and it won’t be great for the development of the young players.”

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2023/04/16/the-buck-stops-here-2023-isnt-richmonds-year-crows-are-the-real-deal-and/

Gunna disagree.
Young is 24 and you bring in mature players only if they can offer something straight away. Well he has filled a hole but he clearly is not an answer imo.

Mansell is 22 yo in yr 3 and has been moved from his primary role as a defender to the graveyard small pressure fwd role.

Miller is 23 and in in year 6 ffs,

They are hardly kids and should be established if good enough.

Ralphsmith well imo he won't make it hope im wrong.

MRJ similar to Hugo just so deficient in basics and the roles they perform.
Any way i digress the point is not all are kids or juniors. The truth is the after the vets there is not a lot of quality to speak of.

Gotta look at games played to see how inexperienced they are. Mega harsh on Young, after playing 5 games in his AFL career he's got a 14.3% 1v1 loss record, 7th best in the comp & he's #1 for spoils at 9.6 per game in the comp. I'm not sure what u are expecting of him...

Just cant agree we only play kids if they are outstanding or we have injuries. There is only plan A, stick with the oldies because we have had success with them there is no succession planning.

Melbourne had 6 juniors in their team that is kids 21 or under we had 3. Three of the 6 kids they played had played just 12 games our three played 52 games between them.
 their average age was 25yr/202 days ours was 26yr/129days.

Take it further we played 8 players aged under 24. Melbourne played 10 players under 24.

This is where experience comes into it Melbourne from that team managed to get 5 of those under 24's to 50 plus games with another who has 30.For us only Balta of that group has got to 50 plus games with 68 and three have recently ticked over 20 games.

It backs up what i have been saying. We only play kids when injuries hit and we are not succession planning.There is little perseverence with kids and you have to ask why.

They fielded a team with 2438 games and we fielded a team with 2611 games.

[the claw]

Just a last one. On the succession planning theme.This is not just me going on because we are losing ive been going on about it for years.

Why are no one asking what the hell have we been doing in this.
For me it starts with recruiting or more to the point list management.It also gets back to the point of Hardwick eking every last drop out of experienced players to the detriment of kids.
The situation now reminds me of where Mathews left Brisbane at the end of 2004.
We just have not looked after list deficiencies list needs or played kids in their right roles or prioritised them over borderline seniors.

No one asking the hard questions how can we become so deficient in so many key areas. The answers are simple but few want to see.

[rogerd3]

Just a last one. On the succession planning theme.This is not just me going on because we are losing ive been going on about it for years.

Why are no one asking what the hell have we been doing in this.
For me it starts with recruiting or more to the point list management.It also gets back to the point of Hardwick eking every last drop out of experienced players to the detriment of kids.
The situation now reminds me of where Mathews left Brisbane at the end of 2004.
We just have not looked after list deficiencies list needs or played kids in their right roles or prioritised them over borderline seniors.

No one asking the hard questions how can we become so deficient in so many key areas. The answers are simple but few want to see.

Geez why aren’t you running the AFL.

[the claw]

Just a last one. On the succession planning theme.This is not just me going on because we are losing ive been going on about it for years.

Why are no one asking what the hell have we been doing in this.
For me it starts with recruiting or more to the point list management.It also gets back to the point of Hardwick eking every last drop out of experienced players to the detriment of kids.
The situation now reminds me of where Mathews left Brisbane at the end of 2004.
We just have not looked after list deficiencies list needs or played kids in their right roles or prioritised them over borderline seniors.

No one asking the hard questions how can we become so deficient in so many key areas. The answers are simple but few want to see.

Geez why aren’t you running the AFL.

Yeah yeah. The thing is im not trying to run anything im just pointing out what should smack everyone in the face but does,t seem to.

2023 just isn’t Richmond’s year

Nathan Buckley
SEN
17 April 2023

“I think the supporters and everyone else need to readjust our expectations of them.

“I think they’ve been coached exceptionally well. I think they’ve been true to themselves, the messaging would be really consistent about the way they want them to play.

“But in the last eight quarters, they’ve kicked 15 goals in two of those quarters, and only eight goals in the other six.

“There’s a big difference between their capacity to score when they execute their kicking or their handball or their simple basics in the game, and when they don’t.

“They’ve just got kids playing that aren’t ready to play in winning teams. That’s not to say they’re not having a go, but there’s just too many of them. (Noah) Cumberland, (Tylar) Young, Maurice Rioli, (Tyler) Sonsie, (Rhyan) Mansell, (Samson) Ryan, (Brad) Miller, (Hugo) Ralphsmith, (Judson) Clarke all played in the side on the weekend. All have got talent and things they can offer the team but there’s just too many at once.

“I don’t think it’s an excuse at all, but I think that the way that Richmond went into this season, their top half looked amazing, they recruited (Tim) Taranto and (Jacob) Hopper, they brought in some players, tried to address a need through the midfield and there’s no doubt they have done that.

“But they’ve just lost too many of their players that they’ve relied on and some of their experienced players have dropped off before they thought they would.

“The expectations need to shift. Damien Hardwick isn’t coaching for success this year, his language has changed slightly. The leaders in the side need to make that adjustment as well because I saw an element of frustration in the way they went about it on the weekend.

“If they continue not to deal with or understand the reality of the situation that they’re in, then that frustration will continue and it won’t be great for the development of the young players.”

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2023/04/16/the-buck-stops-here-2023-isnt-richmonds-year-crows-are-the-real-deal-and/

Gunna disagree.
Young is 24 and you bring in mature players only if they can offer something straight away. Well he has filled a hole but he clearly is not an answer imo.

Mansell is 22 yo in yr 3 and has been moved from his primary role as a defender to the graveyard small pressure fwd role.

Miller is 23 and in in year 6 ffs,

They are hardly kids and should be established if good enough.

Ralphsmith well imo he won't make it hope im wrong.

MRJ similar to Hugo just so deficient in basics and the roles they perform.
Any way i digress the point is not all are kids or juniors. The truth is the after the vets there is not a lot of quality to speak of.

Gotta look at games played to see how inexperienced they are. Mega harsh on Young, after playing 5 games in his AFL career he's got a 14.3% 1v1 loss record, 7th best in the comp & he's #1 for spoils at 9.6 per game in the comp. I'm not sure what u are expecting of him...

Hmm harsh on Young i don't think so. Bottom line is clubs take vfl players and i bet my bottom dollar unlike supporters they dont think they have much more than at best a role player who can play straight away if need be.
They trade or use early fraft picks for what they think are quality players.

Young is a battler. Yep he can fill in if need be when injuries hit but what you see now is what you will get.

[one-eyed]

From Robbo's 'The Tackle' column:


DISLIKES

1. Bye, bye Tigers

And that, ladies and gentlemen, means Richmond won’t play finals this year. Mathematically it’s possible, but the Tigers are in 16th position with one win and a draw from seven games. They have to win at least 12 from the next 15 games to play finals and they haven’t got the team, or the form, or the hunger to trouble the scorers. Sunday’s loss was the season killer. You know what they were? They were boring and unthreatening, which is not the Richmond of the past six years. The first half was a snore-fest, so much so you’d think it was a different sport watching Richmond and Gold Coast play at Marvel Stadium after watching Geelong and Essendon kick monster scores at the MCG. The Suns kicked 4.2 from 31 entries in the first half and Richmond 2.9 from 20 entries. By the end, it was 11.6 to 6.12, with both teams having 53 entries. The Tigers have fallen apart. The top-ups have played their role, especially Tim Taranto, but the fact is Richmond doesn’t have the depth to threaten, they have given up draft picks and we’ve seen the best of the veterans. They are a below average team without Lynch, Nankervis, Tarrant and Gibcus, but pretty sure their return can’t rescue the season.

https://www.codesports.com.au/afl/the-tackle-mark-robinson-names-his-likes-and-dislikes-after-round-7/news-story/378f916cce9ce29b6bc248dd0471b7c1

[Gracie]

Sadly Robbo is correct on this one...

[pmac21]

It would be nice if the following players were still with us:
Butler
Higgins
Chol
Ellis
Markov
Not world beaters but good role players
I'm sure I'm missing others. 
I'm actually missing George also right now.

[Andyy]

It would be nice if the following players were still with us:
Butler
Higgins
Chol
Ellis
Markov
Not world beaters but good role players
I'm sure I'm missing others. 
I'm actually missing George also right now.

Guarantee George would be chasing and trying harder than most of this team

[Francois Jackson]

It would be nice if the following players were still with us:
Butler
Higgins
Chol
Ellis
Markov
Not world beaters but good role players
I'm sure I'm missing others. 
I'm actually missing George also right now.

Guarantee George would be chasing and trying harder than most of this team

100%

[Simonator]

It would be nice if the following players were still with us:
Butler
Higgins
Chol
Ellis
Markov
Not world beaters but good role players
I'm sure I'm missing others. 
I'm actually missing George also right now.

At the time the decision on all these guys was correct so it’s easy to look back now and say you’d want them back.

[one-eyed]

13. RICHMOND (1-5-1, 87.3%)

Last week’s ranking: 12

We declared our continued belief in Richmond last week but it was shaken heavily by that awful Gold Coast loss - awful both because it was a game they simply had to win, and because of how horrid it was to watch. Their forward line is just a mess and while we agree with Damien Hardwick’s general point from his press conference, that their best is good enough but things just keep going wrong, the numbers are just starting to stack up against his side. With one and a half wins on the board, and 16 games left in the season, the Tigers need to go 11-5 from here at worst to play finals (because you’ll almost certainly need 12, if not 13 wins to make the eight). So they can afford five losses. And here are some of the games they have left - Geelong (MCG), Essendon (MCG), St Kilda (Marvel and MCG), Brisbane (Gabba), Melbourne (MCG), Bulldogs (Marvel), Port Adelaide (Adelaide Oval). They have to win at least four of those. Good luck.



https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-2023-power-rankings-after-round-7-analysis-highlights-every-club-ranked-ladder-predictions-contenders-latest-news/news-story/a40c3d4b3d926220480bd829272868a4

[one-eyed]

Power Ranking after Round 8:

12. RICHMOND (2-5-1, 95.7%)

Last week’s ranking: 13

That first half won’t help the Name-A-Game sales at all but the second half saw some classic Richmond ball movement by hand, the likes of which we haven’t seen since... maybe the second quarter against the Bulldogs? The Tigers are still in a real hole when it comes to recovering and playing finals but they’ve taken the first step, and as we’ve said for a while, we don’t think they’re as far off in terms of actual talent as many have been suggesting. Also, man, the Tim Taranto ‘debate’ (or whatever you want to call it) is silly. Rank him where you want, but he’s probably winning their best and fairest right now - and we understand how he became a flashpoint, because big trades are juicy narrative-drivers and fun to write about, but good lord he’s just so obviously not the problem.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-2023-power-rankings-after-round-8-analysis-highlights-every-club-ranked-ladder-predictions-contenders-latest-news/news-story/cb19912bcdf93a88cd894400613b0685

[one-eyed]

Mick McGuane looks at the race for the eighth spot in finals and names the team most likely to win it

Seven teams look set to sail towards September, leaving eight other sides fighting for the final spot. Mick McGuane looks each of the challengers and names his top eight.

Mick McGuane
HeraldSun
May 11, 2023 - 12:00PM

We might only be a third of the way through the season, but the top seven teams look just about locked in for September.

Collingwood and Melbourne are on top of their games and on top of the ladder, St Kilda has a good draw ahead which will help it, Brisbane and Port Adelaide have got themselves on a roll, Geelong has recovered from a sluggish start to the year and the Western Bulldogs remain dangerous.

It means the rest of the competition is in a race for eighth spot.

AFL analyst Mick McGuane looks at the eight teams searching for that last finals spot — if they play their cards right.

15th – RICHMOND (2-5-1)

They might have an uphill battle ahead of them, but I’m not willing to write off Richmond just yet.

Damien Hardwick’s side looked like the Tigers of old in the second half against West Coast last week.

Yes, the Eagles were depleted and have copped a raft of heavy losses this year.

But we were looking for a change of method and some positional shifts from Richmond and we got them.

The Tigers scored a season-high 37 points from forward half intercepts against the Eagles and a season-high 64 points from forward half chains.

Hitting the scoreboard on the back of a strong, in-sync defensive structure and pressure in the forward half of the ground is exactly what this side looks like at its best.

Hardwick also spun the magnets.

Jayden Short went back into the midfield after spending most of the year in defence, Dustin Martin spent significant time onball where he can be more impressive and Marlion Pickett went from a wing to the forward line to add some much-needed pressure in that area of the ground.

The model is there going forward.

If the Tigers continue to believe and play a strong forward-half game, they are capable of turning their season around — and quickly.

MICK’S VERDICT

The Bombers are my pick to win the last spot in the top-eight.

Essendon’s fixture is favourable, with two games to come against each of West Coast and North Melbourne.

Bank those four games and that’s eight wins under your belt.

That would leave Essendon needing to win just five of its other 11 matches to qualify for September.

https://www.codesports.com.au/afl/mick-mcguane-looks-at-the-race-for-the-eighth-spot-in-finals-and-names-the-team-most-likely-to-win-it/news-story/fed8616a57d9fe89b1b7889f3d272dfc

[one-eyed]

Foxfooty.com.au has ran through why the teams competing for that eighth spot can — and can’t — play finals, featuring key Champion Data stats supporting each.

RICHMOND

Why they can

Despite having two wins on the board, its not all gloom and doom at Punt Road. Damien Hardwick’s side is still armed with premiership stars across the board including 15 taking the field in Friday night’s clash with Geelong. They’re the sort of team that could go on serious run, just like last year, and make a push towards the top eight in the second half of the season. You just can’t rule a Hardwick-led team out, particularly if it ever gets healthy and boosted by boom midfield recruits Tim Taranto and Jacob Hopper.

Key Champion Data stat - Ranked 6th in opposition score per inside 50

Why they can’t

Injuries shouldn’t be the overruling reason to blame for the Tigers’ issues, but they’re without arguably the two players they can least afford to be sidelined in Toby Nankervis and Tom Lynch, exposing the club’s key thin position stocks. While Nankervis is nearing his return, Lynch remains a ways off, and the other Tigers forwards are really struggling to carry the load, with Dustin Martin and Shai Bolton down on their brilliant best form. Richmond’s lesser names are also not quite stepping up or buying into their roles like others have in the past.

Key Champion Data stat - Ranked 18th in score per inside 50

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-2023-finals-contenders-why-they-can-and-cant-make-the-top-eight-analysis-predictions-carlton-blues-concerns-latest-news/news-story/ecd1d1ea5448d6b5f7ddc4457c3b8469

[one-eyed]

“THEY’RE BACK”: WHY THE TIGERS COULD STILL BE CONTENDERS IN 2023

Seb Mottram
SEN
13 May 2023

It was the Tigers of old on Friday night.

That was the thinking of thousands who watched Richmond’s win over Geelong where Damien Hardwick’s chaotic game style was in full flight.

The Tigers were belted in clearances and contested possessions as they often are, yet tore Geelong to shreds on transition to kick their second consecutive 100+ score and triumph by 24 points in what was an enthralling clash.

It’s Richmond’s third win of the season and the Tigers could still finish the round as low as 14th on the ladder.

But David King – who has held firm on believing in Richmond this year – believes it could be a defining performance.

“It was an amazing performance last night from the Tiges,” King began on SEN’s Crunch Time.

“We were all waiting to write them off, everyone was ready to put a line through them, it was an Elimination Final yesterday…

“They just have a know-how of how to win games of footy. It had been a tough start to the year for them they got Geelong at the right time with a few outs… but when their big boys flex, gee they're good to watch.

“(Shai) Bolton, (Dustin) Martin, (Trent) Cotchin, (Daniel) Rioli was significant, and then they just have the workers.

“They’re back. I know there’s a long way to get back into the eight and what that means who knows. Are they a contender? Most people would say no.

“But if they limped into 8th, you’d be incredibly unlucky to play the Tigers in a first final if you’ve had a pretty good year and finished 5th.

“That is them, that is how they play and they are difficult to beat and difficult to play against when they play like that.”

Hardwick has won three flags at Richmond and only missed finals once since that Grand Final triumph back in 2017.

Given their record in gaining momentum across the season, King suggested the Tigers could be about to go on a run.

“Of course they can (make the eight). You’d be a fool to write them off because they’re just finding their feet and they do this at the start of seasons every year,” the dual-premiership Kangaroo said.

“They started poor, they’ve been alright the last couple of weeks, but I think their last month has been pretty good.”

A clash of incredible proportions now looms with Dreamtime at the ‘G next Saturday against Essendon.

Games against Port Adelaide, GWS, Fremantle and St Kilda are then to come before the bye.

However, King did lament the Cats’ poor goalkicking that saw them at one point boot 5.11 and eventually 11.12.

On the Geelong side, Chris Scott suggested in his press conference he wasn’t overly fazed by the performance given the cattle on the field.

The Cats had less premiership players on the MCG than Richmond last night, through suspension and injury, but Geelong are now 5-4 after Round 9 – exactly as they were last year.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2023/05/13/theyre-back-why-the-tigers-could-still-be-contenders-in-2023/