Author Topic: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)  (Read 5050 times)

Online Francois Jackson

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #15 on: April 15, 2009, 12:37:32 PM »

Its people like you that run this club and have got absolutely no clue how to run a footy department.


It's people like me that support this club and not bag it mercilessly when things don't go my way.

It's people like me that will continue to support this club unconditionally.

It's people like me that helped make this club what it was, what it is, and what it will be.

It's people like me that inherited the passion for the club and have passed it down to children and grandchildren.

It's people like you who aren't any of the above and just make me sick.

you little beauty thats what i like, a little bit of banter.

what we have inherited collectively as a group is a basket case of a club who has shown no heart for 24 of the last 26 years.

who pays for it? we do. enough is enough we dont deserve this crap that gets dished up and maybe you have seen success in your time so thats why you are blinded but i am not.

Currently a member of the Roupies, and employed by the great man Roup.

FooffooValve

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #16 on: April 15, 2009, 12:53:32 PM »
While our recruiting has been terrible, it's fair to say we haven't had much luck either.

Brown breaks his leg, Newman breaks his leg, Polak gets hit by a tram, Coughlan does his knee twice (once in the shower), and I recall being absolutely delighted when we picked up Deledio AND Tambling in the 2004 draft. Sure, other teams get injuries, but these have been pretty bad and very unlucky.

Still, no excuses for Mark Graham, Kent Kingsley, Knobel, Oakley-Nicholls etc etc.

Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #17 on: April 15, 2009, 01:21:51 PM »
Time out folks and back to the topic
"Oh yes I am a dreamer, I still see us flying high!"

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Con65

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #18 on: April 15, 2009, 01:30:13 PM »
Still, no excuses for Mark Graham, Kent Kingsley, Knobel, Oakley-Nicholls etc etc.

Mark Graham helped Thursty with defensive work to no end...In an article last year Thursty said he still speaks to Graham about defence.  So there was benefit there...plus Graham cost the club next to nothing....

Kingsley...again cost the club next to nothing - a psd-...experiment that failed...so what..

Knob...again cost the club next to nothing - a psd- ... Ottens had just walked out of the club...Simmo had just been recruited but hadnt played yet..and the rest of our ruck stocks (aside from Staff who was aging) looked thin...

JON - still a young kid ...maybe he will make it..maybe he wont...but so what...other clubs also make mistakes with high draft picks...Faren Ray was #4 for the bullies...and is now gorn from their team...Chris Egan was #10 in the 04 draft - just before Thomo Meyers Patto...and gorn.  Go ask a Pies supporter about Danny Roach...see what joy that gives them...look him up...here is a hint #7 1999 draft....and the pies could have had Pavlich if they didnt trade with us...remember pick 3 on Fiora originally came from the pies....so what about JON...he is young and may still make it....just go look at Leon Davis...as an example...

FooffooValve

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #19 on: April 15, 2009, 01:45:23 PM »
The "cost us nothing" line doesn't wash with me. They cost us the chance to take a young player that might be in the side right now, or put more games into youngsters that are still floundering on our list. If you add all of those "costs" up over the last 5 or so years, it adds up to a lot...

Offline Chuck17

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #20 on: April 15, 2009, 01:50:01 PM »
The "cost us nothing" line doesn't wash with me. They cost us the chance to take a young player that might be in the side right now, or put more games into youngsters that are still floundering on our list. If you add all of those "costs" up over the last 5 or so years, it adds up to a lot...

Depends what type of chance you are talking about and what you are comparing it to, a one in a hundred/thousand? chance of a player that low in the draft stakes compared to the benefit of having your raw and young talent gain valuble coaching from experienced campaigners may be a good trade off.

FooffooValve

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #21 on: April 15, 2009, 02:21:49 PM »
I don't think we should base recruitment strategy around getting old campaigners who might pass on some valuable lessons. That's what coaches and the phalanx of assistant coaches and player development people are for.

Our recent drafting is littered with examples of taking older discards who have offered us very little, and who have then taken the place on the field and on the list of a young player that may (yes, may) have developed into a valuable player.

Did Hawthorn top up their ground zero list with old players? No. The only player of similar ilk they took was Dew, much later when they saw a gap emerging from the initial rebuild.

Online Francois Jackson

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #22 on: April 15, 2009, 02:25:43 PM »
I don't think we should base recruitment strategy around getting old campaigners who might pass on some valuable lessons. That's what coaches and the phalanx of assistant coaches and player development people are for.

Our recent drafting is littered with examples of taking older discards who have offered us very little, and who have then taken the place on the field and on the list of a young player that may (yes, may) have developed into a valuable player.

Did Hawthorn top up their ground zero list with old players? No. The only player of similar ilk they took was Dew, much later when they saw a gap emerging from the initial rebuild.


 :clapping :bow

problem is mate you wont win an argument on here with those comments.

People dont see our recruiting as the problem whereas i see it as the major problem with our club.

ooh yeah and you can add Patty Bowden to that list.

Currently a member of the Roupies, and employed by the great man Roup.

Offline Chuck17

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #23 on: April 15, 2009, 02:36:55 PM »
Did Hawthorn top up their ground zero list with old players? No.

No they didnt but name a player that they drafted at a simlar draft pick for what we gave up for Knob, Cant or Graham that is carving it up for them now.

Online Francois Jackson

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #24 on: April 15, 2009, 03:17:24 PM »
Did Hawthorn top up their ground zero list with old players? No.

No they didnt but name a player that they drafted at a simlar draft pick for what we gave up for Knob, Cant or Graham that is carving it up for them now.


Patrick Bowden- 56 pick
Knobel-pre season draft pick 1

Gilham-Rookie Draft, deep pick
Dew
Simon Taylor not killing it by any means but a solid second ruckman to have

from other clubs......
Matthew Egan
Daniel Pratt who was drafted after Graham. Geez how good would he be in our team right now instead we have toothpicks running around witches hats


Regarding Kinsley what a waste that was. Wallace again misinterpreted the list and thought by recruiting Kingsley it would be the final ingredient needed to get us into the 8. How wrong he was??

There are probably some others we could have drafted but why bother the point has been made.

YOU SHOULD NEVER TRADE AWAY DRAFT PICKS WHEN YOU ARE IN A REBUILDING PHASE AS WE ARE/WERE.

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FooffooValve

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2009, 03:25:14 PM »
Think d161 has answered the question, but there are others we could have taken a stab at, eg Eddie Betts.

Con65

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #26 on: April 15, 2009, 03:34:30 PM »
I don't think we should base recruitment strategy around getting old campaigners who might pass on some valuable lessons. That's what coaches and the phalanx of assistant coaches and player development people are for.

Our recent drafting is littered with examples of taking older discards who have offered us very little, and who have then taken the place on the field and on the list of a young player that may (yes, may) have developed into a valuable player.

Did Hawthorn top up their ground zero list with old players? No. The only player of similar ilk they took was Dew, much later when they saw a gap emerging from the initial rebuild.

Ummm...sorry but that is not right.  Hawthorn have consistently picked up an "older" player for a number of years now...perhaps the 2008 draft was the exception for them.

Go read this link: http://www.afl.com.au/News/NEWSARTICLE/tabid/208/Default.aspx?newsId=68273 as to how the Hawks built their list.

In fact 11 of their Grand Final side came pre the 2004 draft.

In 2002 they recruited P. Everitt who cost them picks 6 and 22.  Kinglsey Hunter cost them pick 35.  They traded D. Chick to West Coast for pick 8 and got Luke Brennan who was gone by the end of the 2006 season from Hawthorn.

In 2003 they traded for Simon Beaumont from Carlton...he lasted 2 years and retired after 27 games...He had played 152 games with Carlton beforehand.  They also traded for D. Jacobs from Essendon.  He is also retired.  They drafted Harry Miller.  He was delisted after 2 years.

In 2004 - the infamous draft - Bo Nixon was drafted by them from the Pies plus pick 7 for pick 10 and 37.  

In 2005 they picked up B. Guerra in the psd.

In 2006 they re-drafted Josh Thurgood - now delisted.

In 2007 S. Dew.

And like us they have had their misses at the draft table too....ex.  2004 T. Murphy pick 21, 2005 B. Dowler pick 6 , M. Bailey pick 18 B. Muston at pick 22, 2006 M. Thorp pick 6 and G. Moss 56 (re-rookied and only played 3 games - 2 this year only because of all their injuries).

So Hawthorn didnt build from the ground up as you say...sure they picked up some talented kids...and the 2001 draft was bountiful for them - 4 premiership players in one draft.  But each year they tried to add an older player...not dissimilar to the Tigers...and like the Tigers they too have had their misses...

Offline peggles

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #27 on: April 15, 2009, 04:07:18 PM »
granted, our drafting has been poor.  but i mean, having a look at what he dished up about bulldogs recruiting, it doesn't impress all that much IMO. 

1. fails to mention what a waste andrew mcdougall was for pick 29.
2. dismissed cotchin by mentioning andrejs everitt in that they're both injured at the moment.  i mean, c'mon!!!

Offline Beren

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #28 on: April 15, 2009, 04:11:35 PM »


Mark Graham helped Thursty with defensive work to no end...In an article last year Thursty said he still speaks to Graham about defence.  So there was benefit there...plus Graham cost the club next to nothing....

Kingsley...again cost the club next to nothing - a psd-...experiment that failed...so what..


No he said Gaspar was his mentor and still works with him.

Kent was a great mentor at Coburg.
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

Offline Smokey

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Re: Tigers' picks no match for Dogs: Sheahan (Herald-Sun)
« Reply #29 on: April 15, 2009, 04:16:39 PM »

No he said Gaspar was his mentor and still works with him.


Must be long distance mentoring - Gas is well and truly ensconced back in Perth.