Author Topic: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)  (Read 4099 times)

Offline TigerLand

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #15 on: June 09, 2014, 11:28:56 AM »
Just really hurting.

Not bothering reading the paper and media articles. .. what's the point.
Go Tigers!

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #16 on: June 09, 2014, 11:50:21 AM »
A few weeks ago I was a 50% chance of renewing next year now I'm 95% that I wont be renewing. I dont see the point. The administration has lost me, they have no serious plan, they have no plan, they dont deserve our money. They take our money and waste it on hacks and has beens. We the supporters paid out the club debt, we paid for new facilities and we pay for the Fighting Tiger Fund which was supposed to bring in players and make us competitive. They took our money and brought in duds and rejects from other clubs who are no good. We as members could give Richmond FC $100 million year it wouldnt make any difference. They would just pee it up the wall and spend it on rubbish. Thats it in a nutshell. We just dont have the people at Richmond who know how to bring or get success for our football club.

Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #17 on: June 09, 2014, 12:18:42 PM »
Morning after the night before and I've been think about why I used the term "dishonest" in a post about the 2nd half last night. I've only ever used it once before and that was back when we got thrashed by Carlton at the FTF game.

Why dishonest?

There are lots of reasons for me and I wanted to put them out there because I'm on the brink of walking away. Why now after 30+ years of false hopes, 30+ years of poor seasons am I considering just not doing this anymore

Why? Simply because right now I don't have any respect for the RFC. They treat me like a fool and expect me just to accept what they throw at me

Yes in the past I've been angry with them, yes I've been disgusted with things they have done but I never not had respect for this Club. I may not have agreed with things and decision they've made but I've always respected why they've done them. Because I've believed they were done with the best interest of the club in mind

Sadly not now.

I'm firm in my belief that this has been a build up of things over a period of time and is not just about this year's debacle. It's not just about the coach or players it runs through the entire club.

The thing is when you are winning the things that are wrong get ignored because the wins hide the problems. But when you lose well there is no place to hide and problems that have always been there shine like a beacon in the night. That's what's happening at Richmond circa 2014. The problems that were was a dim flame last year are now shining like a distress beacon in the ocean

Let's go back to when Dimma was first appointed. He told us, no he promised us that players would only get games if they put there head over the ball and when it was their time "to go they had to go" if they didn't they wouldn't get a game. Moving into year five of his tenure I question what happened to that. When did that supposed non-negotiable become a negotiable? Because to me that hasn't been a non-negotiable for over 3 years now. Players who time and time again refuse to "go when it's their turn to go" have continued to be played, literally been gifted games. Why? Blind Freddy can see that games have been given to "favourites" ahead of kids that are busting their guts in the VFL. What sort of message does that send other than a bloody poor one?

Then just this week we get told that we'd get changes but the only changed we get were forced by injury. Another great message as the under performing players get spared what they should clearly face and that's being dropped for not playing up to standard

I expect to get whacked for this and I know I am breaking my own embargo about it. I expect people to say I am being petty. But the decision to allow the current captain to continue to wear his preferred number to number 17 was a poor leadership by the Club in particular the board and management. It also makes me wonder what impact it has had on the playing group and the message it sends. Forget whether you agree with the captain's number concept the fact remains that the Club allowed an individual to dictate a condition of him accepting the captaincy. The lack of leadership shown by the board in this case was wrong in that it sent a poor message to everyone especially the player group. In a way they allowed "the tail to wag the dog". Granted it is a small thing in the overall scheme of things but it is just another example of the lack of leadership that seems to engulf our club

We have a bloke in charge of list management who rates our list and under his rating system he believes certain players are deserving of 3 year contracts when again most people can see that the same players aren't going to improve. Then we lose a certain type of player (White) rather than finding a like type player we go 360 and target a lack of speed. Granted he targeted Maric and that was a great get but the others? More frustrating questions than answers

Then we have the club spin. The warning bells for me this year started during the pre-season when the club started spruiking a top 4 finish. Internally you can have whatever goals you want but for a team that hadn't played in back to back finals series since 1975 the talk externally should have been about improving again to ensure we got enough wins to make finals. Once you get the wins then you can talk about top 4. Then we have not only the coach saying we are a better side than last year but the GM of footy and the CEO saying the same thing. Outside of it being an incredibly stupid statement it was and is clearly a dishonest one

Then we have the off field. We get told that the Club exists for it's members not because of them. This is another dishonest statement. The exists because of us and maybe it's time they to started admitting it. The contempt that we get shown not only with the on field but the off field is just well mind numbing now. They spend so much time trying to find new members that they have forgotten those who have backed them unconditionally for decades. That is simply disrespectful and dishonest

I genuinely feel people who work at the Club like Mr RFC_O and those I speak to in membership and coteries. They are the ones who have to face the anger of the members and supporters. Benny doesn't, Dimma doesn't. They get shielded and justify things with their spin. Stig comes on here and cops abuse simply for doing his job and because he is the only conduit people have to vent at the Club. It is a thankless job but he keeps fronting up and I give him a helluva lot of credit for it. Ditto the folks in membership and the Coterie crew  :clapping

But when it's all said and done the person that I am most angry at is the CEO Benny Gale. He's the one I reckon has played us as fools the most. Smart man is Benny, IMV he has known from the day he started that people would believe him and follow him and above all not question him. He was the great off field hope that we needed. Maybe it is time we started to question him. He stood in front of me at the FTF launch and said it would only be around 2 years at the most, it continues today and the Club's reliance on it is well scary. He gave us the 75-0-3 plan that has failed with the irony of it being the only part that has been successful is the zero debt thanks to the members. He implored people to vote in favour of the constitutional changes that gave the Board the power to appoint their own directors and allow him to sit on the board. The very thing people are now sooking about.

I could go on but what's the point? I just get angrier and more frustrated

Don highlights a key point for me when he said "It's not only the loss. It's the way we lose. We just find new ways to break the hearts of members and supporters."

Never has a truer word been spoken
"Oh yes I am a dreamer, I still see us flying high!"

from the song "Don't Walk Away" by Pat Benatar 1988 (Wide Awake In Dreamland)

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #18 on: June 09, 2014, 12:29:22 PM »
WP's post is one the best posts Ive ever read on this forum or any forum. Its spot on correct in every regard and it shows why the RFC will soon be in a financial crisis as members turn away from the club. The honeymoon period for this administration has well and truly ended. Its over and the results are speaking for themselves.

Offline eliminator

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #19 on: June 09, 2014, 12:35:52 PM »
The life and soul of a club is its fans. I have always thought that our fans were the most loyal and passionate of all AFL clubs. It is the club's treatment of its fans that disgusts me. The club needs to have a good hard look at itself and be honest with its supporters. Its disdain of its loyal supporters will ultimately bring its demise.

Offline Chuck17

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #20 on: June 09, 2014, 01:16:31 PM »
Can this thread be retitled the Princess thread

Thanks


Offline one-eyed

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #21 on: June 09, 2014, 01:23:00 PM »
Cheryl Critchley @CherylCritchley twitter:

What were these guys trying to say last night? And did they get told to take it down? It disappeared. #AFLRoosTigers


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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #22 on: June 09, 2014, 01:25:42 PM »
 WP is on the money
Correct in every view
The club is there so the likes of Hardwick can extract over the top salary .get us know where and after 5 years of $$$$$ go an pay off them home and live happily ever after
FACT
Hardwick much worse than Wallace
Way too much spin
Can tell you Wallace had a crack and a plan A.B and C
Wallace plan B was too play Richo back when 3 goals down and play through him
Hardwick has no idea
Don't get me started on the off field side
Benny Gale has made fools of the supporters

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #23 on: June 09, 2014, 01:30:07 PM »

Cheryl Critchley @CherylCritchley twitter:

What were these guys trying to say last night? And did they get told to take it down? It disappeared. #AFLRoosTigers


https://twitter.com/CherylCritchley

Great Banner  :clapping and everyone knows what they were saying with that Banner. Everyone!



Edited to correct quote!
« Last Edit: June 09, 2014, 01:34:00 PM by WilliamPowell »

Offline tigs2011

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #24 on: June 09, 2014, 02:21:00 PM »
Cheryl Critchley @CherylCritchley twitter:

What were these guys trying to say last night? And did they get told to take it down? It disappeared. #AFLRoosTigers


https://twitter.com/CherylCritchley
That is excellent.  :clapping

Offline Phillip

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #25 on: June 09, 2014, 05:18:21 PM »
Zookahead Cotchin wearing #9 didn't seem to be a problem when we were winning games. I've got no problem with it and neither should any of you.
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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #26 on: June 09, 2014, 05:21:08 PM »
Morning after the night before and I've been think about why I used the term "dishonest" in a post about the 2nd half last night. I've only ever used it once before and that was back when we got thrashed by Carlton at the FTF game.

Why dishonest?

There are lots of reasons for me and I wanted to put them out there because I'm on the brink of walking away. Why now after 30+ years of false hopes, 30+ years of poor seasons am I considering just not doing this anymore

Why? Simply because right now I don't have any respect for the RFC. They treat me like a fool and expect me just to accept what they throw at me

Yes in the past I've been angry with them, yes I've been disgusted with things they have done but I never not had respect for this Club. I may not have agreed with things and decision they've made but I've always respected why they've done them. Because I've believed they were done with the best interest of the club in mind

Sadly not now.

I'm firm in my belief that this has been a build up of things over a period of time and is not just about this year's debacle. It's not just about the coach or players it runs through the entire club.

The thing is when you are winning the things that are wrong get ignored because the wins hide the problems. But when you lose well there is no place to hide and problems that have always been there shine like a beacon in the night. That's what's happening at Richmond circa 2014. The problems that were was a dim flame last year are now shining like a distress beacon in the ocean

Let's go back to when Dimma was first appointed. He told us, no he promised us that players would only get games if they put there head over the ball and when it was their time "to go they had to go" if they didn't they wouldn't get a game. Moving into year five of his tenure I question what happened to that. When did that supposed non-negotiable become a negotiable? Because to me that hasn't been a non-negotiable for over 3 years now. Players who time and time again refuse to "go when it's their turn to go" have continued to be played, literally been gifted games. Why? Blind Freddy can see that games have been given to "favourites" ahead of kids that are busting their guts in the VFL. What sort of message does that send other than a bloody poor one?

Then just this week we get told that we'd get changes but the only changed we get were forced by injury. Another great message as the under performing players get spared what they should clearly face and that's being dropped for not playing up to standard

I expect to get whacked for this and I know I am breaking my own embargo about it. I expect people to say I am being petty. But the decision to allow the current captain to continue to wear his preferred number to number 17 was a poor leadership by the Club in particular the board and management. It also makes me wonder what impact it has had on the playing group and the message it sends. Forget whether you agree with the captain's number concept the fact remains that the Club allowed an individual to dictate a condition of him accepting the captaincy. The lack of leadership shown by the board in this case was wrong in that it sent a poor message to everyone especially the player group. In a way they allowed "the tail to wag the dog". Granted it is a small thing in the overall scheme of things but it is just another example of the lack of leadership that seems to engulf our club

We have a bloke in charge of list management who rates our list and under his rating system he believes certain players are deserving of 3 year contracts when again most people can see that the same players aren't going to improve. Then we lose a certain type of player (White) rather than finding a like type player we go 360 and target a lack of speed. Granted he targeted Maric and that was a great get but the others? More frustrating questions than answers

Then we have the club spin. The warning bells for me this year started during the pre-season when the club started spruiking a top 4 finish. Internally you can have whatever goals you want but for a team that hadn't played in back to back finals series since 1975 the talk externally should have been about improving again to ensure we got enough wins to make finals. Once you get the wins then you can talk about top 4. Then we have not only the coach saying we are a better side than last year but the GM of footy and the CEO saying the same thing. Outside of it being an incredibly stupid statement it was and is clearly a dishonest one

Then we have the off field. We get told that the Club exists for it's members not because of them. This is another dishonest statement. The exists because of us and maybe it's time they to started admitting it. The contempt that we get shown not only with the on field but the off field is just well mind numbing now. They spend so much time trying to find new members that they have forgotten those who have backed them unconditionally for decades. That is simply disrespectful and dishonest

I genuinely feel people who work at the Club like Mr RFC_O and those I speak to in membership and coteries. They are the ones who have to face the anger of the members and supporters. Benny doesn't, Dimma doesn't. They get shielded and justify things with their spin. Stig comes on here and cops abuse simply for doing his job and because he is the only conduit people have to vent at the Club. It is a thankless job but he keeps fronting up and I give him a helluva lot of credit for it. Ditto the folks in membership and the Coterie crew  :clapping

But when it's all said and done the person that I am most angry at is the CEO Benny Gale. He's the one I reckon has played us as fools the most. Smart man is Benny, IMV he has known from the day he started that people would believe him and follow him and above all not question him. He was the great off field hope that we needed. Maybe it is time we started to question him. He stood in front of me at the FTF launch and said it would only be around 2 years at the most, it continues today and the Club's reliance on it is well scary. He gave us the 75-0-3 plan that has failed with the irony of it being the only part that has been successful is the zero debt thanks to the members. He implored people to vote in favour of the constitutional changes that gave the Board the power to appoint their own directors and allow him to sit on the board. The very thing people are now sooking about.

I could go on but what's the point? I just get angrier and more frustrated

Don highlights a key point for me when he said "It's not only the loss. It's the way we lose. We just find new ways to break the hearts of members and supporters."

Never has a truer word been spoken

WP :bow :thumbsup :cheers :clapping :gotigers

Hellenic Tiger

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #27 on: June 09, 2014, 05:23:15 PM »
Cheryl Critchley @CherylCritchley twitter:

What were these guys trying to say last night? And did they get told to take it down? It disappeared. #AFLRoosTigers


https://twitter.com/CherylCritchley

Of course it did. We don't need radicals in the supporter group destabilising the masses we need smileys and happys forking over their hard earned whilst fat man from the monopoly board rubs his hands together and counts the loot. :help

Offline Diocletian

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #28 on: June 09, 2014, 05:29:04 PM »
Where was that? Was at the game and never saw it. Must've beeen confiscated early on.
"Much of the social history of the Western world, over the past three decades, has been a history of replacing what worked with what sounded good...."

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FJ is the only one that makes sense.

Offline YellowandBlackBlood

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Re: The Honesty About Dishonesty (Split from Nth Match Day thread)
« Reply #29 on: June 09, 2014, 07:47:44 PM »
Zookahead Cotchin wearing #9 didn't seem to be a problem when we were winning games. I've got no problem with it and neither should any of you.
I don't have problem with it but it is the principle that WP is talking about.  The club rightly or wrongly said the Captain would wear the great JD's number.  It appoints a young captain and then he immediately turns around and says he wants to keep his number.  FFS who is he to dictate to the club who has just bestowed him their greatest honour?  He should have been grateful that he got the captain's position not started making demands himself!
I initially didn't mind what he wanted but I can now see that WP was correct right from the start.
It is a problem that has been at Richmond since Raines and Cloke left the club.  The tail has wagged the dog and the club has been to afraid to argue with players and has bowed to their needs.
Winning games just hid the undercurrent but now it is just one of the things that is there for all to see.
OER. Calling it as it is since 2004.