Author Topic: Jack Graham that is [merged]  (Read 164930 times)

Offline pmac21

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #735 on: September 29, 2022, 08:02:02 PM »
Assuming it wouldn’t make its way to GWS as part of the hopper/Taranto deals, would people be satisfied if port gave up pick 8 for graham and our pick 19? Ideally it would be our pick 30 instead but don’t think port do that.

A pick upgrade is not enough for him.  2x premiership player at 24.  Gut runner.  He's not that far behind Taranto in quality. 

Offline Tiger Khosh

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #736 on: September 29, 2022, 08:19:45 PM »
Assuming it wouldn’t make its way to GWS as part of the hopper/Taranto deals, would people be satisfied if port gave up pick 8 for graham and our pick 19? Ideally it would be our pick 30 instead but don’t think port do that.

A pick upgrade is not enough for him.  2x premiership player at 24.  Gut runner.  He's not that far behind Taranto in quality.

I disagree that he’s not far off taranto in terms of quality. Taranto is an out and out gun imo and graham is a very good role player (albeit an important role for us). Taranto pretty much matches jack in the defensive side of things including pressure rating and tackles while being far superior in clearances and contested possessions.

While I’m proud of all the multiple time premiership players that we have, I don’t think it holds the same weight for everyone at the trade table in terms of bringing up their value as significantly as some suggest. For example the much maligned Castagna was a 3 time premiership player at age 24.

Online Hard Roar Tiger

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #737 on: September 29, 2022, 10:36:51 PM »
I think this idea of us having cap space is a bit of a furphy

Granted he's not the most reliable source but Tom Brown on Ch7 news last night said there was a "good cap squeeze" going on at Punt Road and rhat even Lynch had agreed to spread out his $$$ ofr next season to bring in Tarranto and Hopper

While I agree he is not a superstar player he is certainly a superstar person. A natural born leader and one of the most popular members of the playing group.

And as I've said a few times the Club needs to be very careful with what they do. We've built something very special and sometimes it isn't solely about the on field but what off field and what impact a player has on the fabric of a club.

It will be what it will be

But IMHO it will be a huge loss if he goes

We’ve finished 12th and 7th. It was special. Let’s not get caught up in something that happened that was 2 years ago. It quickly becomes
5 years ago then all of a sudden we’re Essendon.
“I find it nearly impossible to make those judgments, but he is certainly up there with the really important ones, he is certainly up there with the Francis Bourkes and the Royce Harts and the Kevin Bartlett and the Kevin Sheedys, there is no doubt about that,” Balme said.

Offline Willy

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #738 on: September 29, 2022, 10:48:18 PM »
I think this idea of us having cap space is a bit of a furphy

Granted he's not the most reliable source but Tom Brown on Ch7 news last night said there was a "good cap squeeze" going on at Punt Road and rhat even Lynch had agreed to spread out his $$$ ofr next season to bring in Tarranto and Hopper

While I agree he is not a superstar player he is certainly a superstar person. A natural born leader and one of the most popular members of the playing group.

And as I've said a few times the Club needs to be very careful with what they do. We've built something very special and sometimes it isn't solely about the on field but what off field and what impact a player has on the fabric of a club.

It will be what it will be

But IMHO it will be a huge loss if he goes

We’ve finished 12th and 7th. It was special. Let’s not get caught up in something that happened that was 2 years ago. It quickly becomes
5 years ago then all of a sudden we’re Essendon.

Bang on.

There was nothing special about us over the last two years.

I like that the club is being agreesive in trying to improve the list.

Offline Fluffy Tiger

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #739 on: September 29, 2022, 11:38:18 PM »
People on here raved on about the "culture" of the club when we were losing but over the last few years the world hardly ever gets used. Some players are key to a clubs culture and even though I have no inside information I would think Graham is one of those. It's imperative to keep the bond of the playing group close and trading these sorts of guys doesn't help that. Look at what other clubs have copied from us over the last few years, game plan and tightness of the playing group and you can see it's such an important part of success. My vote is to try and keep him if possible. Hope we can do that.
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Online Hard Roar Tiger

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #740 on: September 30, 2022, 07:25:07 AM »
I agree Fluff but I’d have Hopper and Taranto over Graham purely on football impact. I also don’t see how Hartley would be planning to gain those two and lose Graham so keeping him should be in our plans - both list and cap.
“I find it nearly impossible to make those judgments, but he is certainly up there with the really important ones, he is certainly up there with the Francis Bourkes and the Royce Harts and the Kevin Bartlett and the Kevin Sheedys, there is no doubt about that,” Balme said.

Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #741 on: September 30, 2022, 08:44:05 AM »
People on here raved on about the "culture" of the club when we were losing but over the last few years the world hardly ever gets used. Some players are key to a clubs culture and even though I have no inside information I would think Graham is one of those. It's imperative to keep the bond of the playing group close and trading these sorts of guys doesn't help that. Look at what other clubs have copied from us over the last few years, game plan and tightness of the playing group and you can see it's such an important part of success. My vote is to try and keep him if possible. Hope we can do that.

Exactly the point I have been trying to make but clearly haven't as well as this post

HRT, just on your comment shout having Taranto & Hopper over Graham. Understand your point but wouldn't you want a Graham over a Ross, Castagna, Dow?
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Offline Tiger Khosh

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #742 on: September 30, 2022, 08:59:16 AM »
A lot of these comments are assuming the club is pushing out the door to clear cap space rather than jack himself looking at other clubs for more midfield opportunity/long term contract/greater pay.

Offline Assange Tiger 😎

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #743 on: September 30, 2022, 09:10:41 AM »
A lot of these comments are assuming the club is pushing out the door to clear cap space rather than jack himself looking at other clubs for more midfield opportunity/long term contract/greater pay.
Yep, it's odd. Jack is a realist and he hasn't exactly hidden the fact he wouldn't mind going home one day. He's just been overlooked for an Elimination Final due to being sore yet was still an emergency. Next year we'll have Dusty back playing regularly and 2 midfielders who are clearly better footballers coming on board.

I'm sure he's weighing up a bigger role, potential of a good contract and a return to SA. Same way the club will weigh up whether it's worth facilitating a trade.

Whatever happens, it's not going to shatter the club
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Offline georgies31

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #744 on: September 30, 2022, 09:15:29 AM »
Say it again if our club can't replace a Jack Graham we're in a world of trouble simple as that. You bring in 2 very good quality players something has to give club needs to be aggressive or we will fall behind the pack.Taranto and Hooper lead Graham in the 2 most important stat's tackling and clearances.

Offline georgies31

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #745 on: September 30, 2022, 09:24:05 AM »
People on here raved on about the "culture" of the club when we were losing but over the last few years the world hardly ever gets used. Some players are key to a clubs culture and even though I have no inside information I would think Graham is one of those. It's imperative to keep the bond of the playing group close and trading these sorts of guys doesn't help that. Look at what other clubs have copied from us over the last few years, game plan and tightness of the playing group and you can see it's such an important part of success. My vote is to try and keep him if possible. Hope we can do that.

Exactly the point I have been trying to make but clearly haven't as well as this post

HRT, just on your comment shout having Taranto & Hopper over Graham. Understand your point but wouldn't you want a Graham over a Ross, Castagna, Dow?

Taranto and Hopper have Graham in there pockets let's not kid ourselves here. I don't believe his a future captain at our club I don't think his best 22 if things work out for us.

Offline Assange Tiger 😎

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #746 on: September 30, 2022, 09:28:55 AM »
People on here raved on about the "culture" of the club when we were losing but over the last few years the world hardly ever gets used. Some players are key to a clubs culture and even though I have no inside information I would think Graham is one of those. It's imperative to keep the bond of the playing group close and trading these sorts of guys doesn't help that. Look at what other clubs have copied from us over the last few years, game plan and tightness of the playing group and you can see it's such an important part of success. My vote is to try and keep him if possible. Hope we can do that.

Exactly the point I have been trying to make but clearly haven't as well as this post

HRT, just on your comment shout having Taranto & Hopper over Graham. Understand your point but wouldn't you want a Graham over a Ross, Castagna, Dow?

He is a much better players than all you mentioned. But Castagna is a forward who wasn't in the side at the end of the year. Ross is still relatively young and the jury is out, but his last 2 games against top opposition were good. Dow is a kid and I have my doubts but I don't understand your point. I suppose you could say he would be somewhat in competition with Dow/Ross for a spot but I can easily see all of them missing out on a game. If I had to pick one to play in a GF it'd be Graham but I'm pretty bloody stoked with what our midfield is going to have next season, with or without Jack.
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Online Andyy

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #747 on: September 30, 2022, 09:38:13 AM »
People on here raved on about the "culture" of the club when we were losing but over the last few years the world hardly ever gets used. Some players are key to a clubs culture and even though I have no inside information I would think Graham is one of those. It's imperative to keep the bond of the playing group close and trading these sorts of guys doesn't help that. Look at what other clubs have copied from us over the last few years, game plan and tightness of the playing group and you can see it's such an important part of success. My vote is to try and keep him if possible. Hope we can do that.

Exactly the point I have been trying to make but clearly haven't as well as this post

HRT, just on your comment shout having Taranto & Hopper over Graham. Understand your point but wouldn't you want a Graham over a Ross, Castagna, Dow?

He is a much better players than all you mentioned. But Castagna is a forward who wasn't in the side at the end of the year. Ross is still relatively young and the jury is out, but his last 2 games against top opposition were good. Dow is a kid and I have my doubts but I don't understand your point. I suppose you could say he would be somewhat in competition with Dow/Ross for a spot but I can easily see all of them missing out on a game. If I had to pick one to play in a GF it'd be Graham but I'm pretty bloody stoked with what our midfield is going to have next season, with or without Jack.

Damned right on your last sentence there.

Cotch
Prestia
Taranto
Hopper
Bolton
Dusty
Sonsie

Graham maybe just forced out unfortunately.

After 97 games though I think it's optimistic for some to think he has another level to go to.

Offline the claw

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #748 on: September 30, 2022, 10:37:58 AM »
People on here raved on about the "culture" of the club when we were losing but over the last few years the world hardly ever gets used. Some players are key to a clubs culture and even though I have no inside information I would think Graham is one of those. It's imperative to keep the bond of the playing group close and trading these sorts of guys doesn't help that. Look at what other clubs have copied from us over the last few years, game plan and tightness of the playing group and you can see it's such an important part of success. My vote is to try and keep him if possible. Hope we can do that.

Exactly the point I have been trying to make but clearly haven't as well as this post

HRT, just on your comment shout having Taranto & Hopper over Graham. Understand your point but wouldn't you want a Graham over a Ross, Castagna, Dow?
Castagna is a three times premiership plyer and clearly a much liked player of the whole group but ther would be no comment about the culture with him if he should get the arse.

I don't get how many times does it have to be said just because you have a premiership it does not neccesarily make you a better player fmd there are so so many instances riddled thru the history of the game where some pretty average players have won a flag or more and played 100 plus games.

As for the culture it was built and continues to be driven by the many oler players we now have at the club. Losing a few popular players wont chabge that.

I think the way F/A and the way players are changing clubs regularly goes it will have little bearing on the so called culture players won't be upset at Graham wanting out or being offered up for trade that is how the system works today.

We have all watched JG and we all think our versions of JG  are the right versions  based on what we see. That leaves just one other avenue and thats the stats and boy we have a decent body of work to judge him by almost 100 games.

The stats in anyones language are saying average player who is miles behind others and in particular the two lads we are going to bring in.
I think Jack knows the writing is on the wall and he will not get a game in the midfield for us. Nor will others Ross Dow etc not unless we are ruined by injury  and that makes all of em nothing but depth players.

Anyway 97 games in and Mr Graham goes at

16.6 DISPOSALS that has to be below average for a mid.
0.4 Goals yep hes a good kick for goal but he is hardly prolific.
5.6 Tackles Thats pretty good but a lot of inside bulls are around this not getting a heap of ball and his pace says to me this will always be high.
1.8 Clearances sheesh no wonder we are after blokes like Taranto and Hopper.
6.1 Contested possesions again an are we needed to fix hence the arrival of Hopper and Taranto.

I/50 Are okay G/A Ordinary what else lacks pace but has a good kick  bottom line is what are we losing here an okay player who is also a good club man. it is not going to rip the heart out of us.

Offline mightytiges

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Re: Jack Graham that is [merged]
« Reply #749 on: September 30, 2022, 01:19:24 PM »
Port received a second rounder (pick 27) as compo for Amon.

That's not going to appease us for Graham if Jack wants to leave.
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