Callum Coleman-Jones traded to Norf [Official]

[mightytiges]

Richmond and North Melbourne, meanwhile, have also begun discussions with the Bulldogs on a trade for Callum Coleman-Jones that would involve pick 17.

Under that scenario, the Dogs would improve their points position, Richmond would secure pick 17, and North would slide a few places in the draft.

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/pick-17-holds-the-key-western-bulldogs-first-rounder-could-unlock-two-different-deals-20211005-p58xha.html

Trying to guess what this will be?


Initially, I thought they meant this:  ( but we get screwed  )

Richmond:   CCJ + 38 + 42 + 47 (1116 pts) --->  Tarrant  + 17 (1025 pts)

Norf:           Tarrant + 40 (429 pts) -------------> CCJ + 47 (316 pts)

Bulldogs:     17 (1025 pts) -----------------------> 38 + 40 + 42 (1289 pts)



Alternatively, I then thought this:

Richmond:   CCJ + 28 + 42 + 47 (1388 pts) ------>  Tarrant  + 17 + 20 (1937 pts) ..... a gain of 549 pts (~pick 34)

Norf:           Tarrant + 20 + 40 (1341 pts) --------> CCJ + 28 (677 pts) ..... a loss of 664 pts (~pick 29)

Bulldogs:     17 (1025 pts) -------------------------> 40 + 42 + 47 (1140 pts)  ..... Dogs gain 115 extra points.


In other words, we effectively trade CCJ for Tarrant + 34.


This would leave us with picks 7, 15, 17, 20, 26 + 38 (Chol) + Tarrant.


Thoughts?


( note: If our pick 26 was used instead of pick 28 above then it would effectively become CCJ for Tarrant + 37 )
(        North would then effectively be doing Tarrant + 31 for CCJ rather than Tarrant + 29                      )

[Andyy]

Better MT, but I don't know if that's enough points for WB to trade out their 17 to us over someone else. I'm sure there will be other clubs fielding offers for that pick so we need to offer them a sufficient points surplus. We aren't likely to use all those later picks anyway so my plan would be as below.

Losing Tarrant will apparently gain North no draft pick due to his age. Therefore his best value to them now is to add him as a sweetener to a trade with Richmond (on the assumption CCJ allegedly doesn't want to go vis PSD as we hope).

Taking Tarrant as a FA will cost us Chol compo (38) so if we can include him in a trade he gains us a value of pick 38 IMO.

CCJ for North's 40 + Tarrant (ie pick 38).
40 + 38 is the points equivalent of 21.

Then we can trade 38, 40 & 41 to WB for 17. Or throw in 47 if we don't want to use it this year with a 2022 3rd coming back our way (probz 50ish).

In: Tarrant, 17
Out: CCJ, 38, 40, 41

Draft with 7, 15, 17, 26, 28, 47

[pmac21]

Better MT, but I don't know if that's enough points for WB to trade out their 17 to us over someone else. I'm sure there will be other clubs fielding offers for that pick so we need to offer them a sufficient points surplus. We aren't likely to use all those later picks anyway so my plan would be as below.

Losing Tarrant will apparently gain North no draft pick due to his age. Therefore his best value to them now is to add him as a sweetener to a trade with Richmond (on the assumption CCJ allegedly doesn't want to go vis PSD as we hope).

Taking Tarrant as a FA will cost us Chol compo (38) so if we can include him in a trade he gains us a value of pick 38 IMO.

CCJ for North's 40 + Tarrant (ie pick 38).
40 + 38 is the points equivalent of 21.

Then we can trade 38, 40 & 41 to WB for 17. Or throw in 47 if we don't want to use it this year with a 2022 3rd coming back our way (probz 50ish).

In: Tarrant, 17
Out: CCJ, 38, 40, 41

Draft with 7, 15, 17, 26, 28, 47

Then go to Crows for 2 & 23 for 7 & 15, I know they have rejected it but they may get desperate.
Leaves us with 4, 17, 23, 26, 28 & 47
Trade 28 & 47 into next year assuming we have 4 picks this year, if five picks keep 28

[Andyy]

Then go to Crows for 2 & 23 for 7 & 15, I know they have rejected it but they may get desperate.
Leaves us with 4, 17, 23, 26, 28 & 47
Trade 28 & 47 into next year assuming we have 4 picks this year, if five picks keep 28

I'm no draft expert but most reports seem to indicate the top 4 is a class above so unless we have a specific target between 6-8 in the draft order that we want I think we should keep our picks.

Otherwise if we can trade into the top 4 (ie pick 2 basically) that would be great to get Callaghan but I wouldn't bother if we can't.

[mightytiges]

Better MT, but I don't know if that's enough points for WB to trade out their 17 to us over someone else. I'm sure there will be other clubs fielding offers for that pick so we need to offer them a sufficient points surplus. We aren't likely to use all those later picks anyway so my plan would be as below.

Losing Tarrant will apparently gain North no draft pick due to his age. Therefore his best value to them now is to add him as a sweetener to a trade with Richmond (on the assumption CCJ allegedly doesn't want to go vis PSD as we hope).

Taking Tarrant as a FA will cost us Chol compo (38) so if we can include him in a trade he gains us a value of pick 38 IMO.

CCJ for North's 40 + Tarrant (ie pick 38).
40 + 38 is the points equivalent of 21.

Then we can trade 38, 40 & 41 to WB for 17. Or throw in 47 if we don't want to use it this year with a 2022 3rd coming back our way (probz 50ish).

In: Tarrant, 17
Out: CCJ, 38, 40, 41

Draft with 7, 15, 17, 26, 28, 47

It's probably a moot point as it looks like we are unlikely to get the Dogs pick 17. But ignoring that for now, the article above said North slip back a few places in the draft while we would get pick 17 off the Dogs. That's why I didn't have two separate trades. The article suggested one trade involving us, North and the Dogs.

The Dogs are supposedly getting 1500 points via that 4-way trade with Melbourne, Adelaide & St Kilda. So to up our offer we could throw in pick 38 for the Dogs future 3rd say or a swap of future 3rds where we get North's future 3rd and North gets the Dogs future 3rd in return. Something like that.

Richmond:   CCJ + 28 + 38 + 42 + 47 ------>  Tarrant  + 17 + 20 + Dogs' Future 3rd

Norf:           Tarrant + 20 + 40  --------> CCJ + 28

Bulldogs:     17 (1025 pts) + Future 3rd --------> 38 + 40 + 42 + 47 (1606 pts)  ..... Dogs gain 581 extra points
                                                                                                                           which is more than the 4-way trade offer.


This would leave us with picks 7, 15, 17, 20, 26 + Dogs' Future 3rd + Tarrant.

[Rampsation]

The last one is ok

Id like to see us trade out Caddy and Pickett to create salary cap space for 12 months time and to bring in a couple of picks in the 30s so we can upgrade our current picks

[mightytiges]

This would leave us with picks 7, 15, 17, 20, 26 + Dogs' Future 3rd + Tarrant.

Further to this based on pmac's idea of trying to move up into the top 4 of the draft:


If we could get the Dogs' pick 17 (see above) then with picks 7, 15, 17, 20, 26 plus Freo's future 3rd.


1) We could do a swap with Freo:

    Rich  15 + 20
    Freo   8 + future 3rd

    That would leave us with picks 7, 8, 17, 26 plus Freo future 3rd + Dogs' future 3rd.


2) Then swap with GWS:

    Rich  7 + 8
    GWS 2 + 13

    GWS will still get Mac Andrew at 7 while we get the midfielder of our choice at pick 2.

    That would leave us with picks 2, 13, 17, 26 plus Freo future 3rd + Dogs' future 3rd.


3) Then offer Gold Coast this 2 for 1 first rounder trade:

    Rich  13 + future 1st* (2022 draft)
    GC     3

    * We can offer our future 2022 first pick on the proviso next year we swap our future 2023 first rounder to regain a 2022 first rounder.
 
       Charlie Naish is available as F/S in 2023 and if he will be as good as everyone is claiming then he could cop a bid in the first round of the 2023 draft. We then wouldn't need a 2023 first rounder as we would only need to accumulate points using later picks to match any bid on him.


4) So all up we would be left with picks 2, 3, 17, 26 plus Freo's future 3rd + Dogs' future 3rd.


    We could then draft the two best midfielders we want with picks 2 & 3.

[OneEyedRichmond]

There’s some deluded pick swappers here… you’re kidding yourselves if you think the bulldogs will swap pick 17 for only a 100-200pt gain. It’ll be a 400-500pt gain, some people have no idea.

[mightytiges]

There’s some deluded pick swappers here… you’re kidding yourselves if you think the bulldogs will swap pick 17 for only a 100-200pt gain. It’ll be a 400-500pt gain, some people have no idea.

It was in the end a gain of 581 pts for pick 17 if you read the whole thing.

I also said it was a moot point as we're not getting pick 17 now anyway.

[Rampsation]

Guessing pick swaps is too hard. The morons at big footy have phds on pick swapping. If we cant do some simple trades to upgrade then just go the draft with what we have. We have a great draft hand already.

[one-eyed]

TARRANT INVOLVED IN CCJ TALKS

NORTH Melbourne and Richmond continue to workshop trade ideas for ruckman Callum Coleman-Jones and defender Robbie Tarrant, with the future of both players likely to become clearer by Friday.

AFL.com.au understands the Kangaroos' initial offer, made on Monday, included a future third-round pick but also Tarrant in exchange for Coleman-Jones and a future fourth-round selection to help the Tigers retain their compensation for losing Mabior Chol.

Richmond risks diluting the end-of-second-round compensation it received last week following Chol's move to Gold Coast, should it bring Tarrant to the club as an unrestricted free agent in the coming days.

It's understood the AFL's tiered compensation system would mean that Richmond's pick No.38, received for Chol's departure, would be pushed back around 10 selections should Tarrant arrive via free agency.

It's led to trade talks between the two sides to avoid the pick sliding back, with a number of options – the majority of which involving Tarrant in a package for Coleman-Jones – being hashed out between the two sides.

A decision on whether the Tigers plan to execute a free agency move for the 32-year-oldmust be made by 5pm AEDT on Friday, when the AFL's unrestricted free agency period closes. If not, he must move via a trade.

Tarrant has already accepted a two-year offer to move to Richmond, where he will chase a premiership under Damien Hardwick after 174 games and 14 seasons with North Melbourne.

Coleman-Jones, 22, has requested a trade to the Kangaroos after nine games across four seasons with the Tigers. He is tipped to eventually succeed the 33-year-old Todd Goldstein as the long-term No.1 ruck at Arden Street.

– Riley Beveridge

https://www.afl.com.au/news/683092/roos-tigers-consider-players-in-swap-dawson-deal-gets-really-complicated

[gtig]

if we could pick up Xerri coming back the other way as part of the trade.. is he any good?

[MintOnLamb]

if we could pick up Xerri coming back the other way as part of the trade.. is he any good?

X factor

[Andyy]

if we could pick up Xerri coming back the other way as part of the trade.. is he any good?

He's trash. Sending him our way is a North idea/joke/middle finger.

[one-eyed]

Q: Any update on the CCJ negotiations?

David Zita: Still pretty far apart on both sides at the moment Blake - no one wants to go to pre-season draft so I think it'll get done, just going to take some time.


Q: Hi Ben, is there any news on what trades NM are looking for besides CCJ? Thank you. Josip.

Ben Waterworth: Hey Josip, they're working out a deal that invovles Tarrant I think as well and future picks. Still a bit to play out.


Q: Hi Ben, how do you think the North and Richmond Tarrant/CCJ deal ends up getting done? In particular what picks move?

Ben Waterworth: I think Pick 38 will exchange hands


Q: Given all of Richmond's picks this year compared to spots on their list - could North and the Tigers be negotiating the swap of a few of them this year and next as parts of the CCJ/Tarrant trade?

Ben Waterworth: Hi Billy, yeah I reckon that's all being taken into consideration.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-trade-news-rumours-whispers-2021-trade-blog-and-live-chat-for-october-7-free-agency-trade-period-updates-news/news-story/1af546bf5f333eb5356eed2f629486f6