Post-season autopsy

[mightytiges]

Not the time to make final decisions straight after that shocker last night but in hindsight there's quite a few things that need to be answered and rectified over the off-season.

* Were we primed and at our peak for the finals? Both AFL & VFL teams failed to reach the big dance after finishing the H/A season top of the ladder. We clearly didn't turn up to play last night.

* Playing injured & sick players in a knockout final? Dusty was cleary hampered as he hardly kicked the footy while Astbury was sick. I posted in the game thread that Andy Maher was saying this arvo that there were rumours that Astbury wasn't the only one affected by the 'flu'. Was this true or false?

* Will our smaller forward win us another flag? Obviously our forward line changes next year with both Jack & Lynch playing alongside each other.

* Our ruck stocks? It's Nank then daylight on our list. Grundy & Cox destroyed us (Grundy record hitouts in a final, Pies had 20-6 hitouts to advantage). Gave them first use of the footy. More concerning, our clearance numbers have been down all season which wasn't the case in 2017. We've got away with it this year by the way we set-up but last night we paid the price.

* Is our list good enough to dust themselves off, reset and go again with minor tweaks or have they reached their limit and we need more significant changes? 

[Assange Tiger 😎]

Of course there has to be some changes.

The great clubs don't just go back to the well or pick up a guy like Lynch and say "that's all we need".

Constantly need to adapt/change.

If Grigg/Houli/Conca are all walk up starts next season then we may still win it but we'd be pretty lucky

[Diocletian]

For all the glaring deficiencies that were exposed tonight, Dusty goes in fully fit tonight and we win. 

/thread 

[Lozza]

No major changes needed, our systems work, I think someone during the year said it would take a team to play the perfect game of football to knock us off at the G, the Pies played that game tonight.

We dust ourselves off and maybe apply a few tweaks to the game plan plus some new additions to the playing list and I am confident we will be right up there challenging again next season.

[georgies31]

The Grigg ruck experiment is gone.Need a ruck forward type simple as that lacking height in side.Even with Lynch coming won't solve that.We need to change game plan a bit to predictable now for me.

[Francois Jackson]

the real question that needs to be answered is how can we go  to a mid table clearance side?

It cost us tonight in a big way. Do we need another bull of a mid?

cant see anyone out there that we could get to fill this void TBH

some really obvious changes apart from peeing that wanker conca off is

out georgie, in stengle/bolton

[Tigeritis™©®]

 

No major changes needed, our systems work, I think someone during the year said it would take a team to play the perfect game of football to knock us off at the G, the Pies played that game tonight.

We dust ourselves off and maybe apply a few tweaks to the game plan plus some new additions to the playing list and I am confident we will be right up there challenging again next season.

We need another quality mid, our midfield doesn’t bat deep enough.
The Conca /BEllis types aren’t gonna cut it in finals.

Need to find a quality ball extractor. We can’t continue conceding centre clearences.

We need better wingman also. 

[Dougeytherichmondfan]

Could have had the greatest team ever assembled, we weren't gunna win tonight. Could see it from the 3 minute mark.

Just gotta swallow it and move on, Shame, but they were way too good tonight,

Conca - love ya but YEESH stinky tonight.

Astbury - LOVE ya but yipes - one of your worst.

Chip up and fly right for next year!

 

[Owl]

Conca is just terrible with decision making.  Turnover central.  Was slipping over at the start of the game same as were a couple of others like fools with the wrong footwear on which made my blood boil, didn't see opposition players doing that.  Not good enough in a final.  Grigg should be polyfilla for next year, he is slow as a wet week, Houli headed that way too.  Frappin out with crap picks is a shyte waste of a year imo. We have some good young blokes coming through but these grandfinal chances are so bloody tough to get.

[Andyy]

I hope the following players never line up for us again:
B Ellis
C Menadue
R Conca
C Ellis

Terrible decision to play the likes of Dusty and Astbury. Should have been Garthwaite and Butler out there.

Nank tries hard but he will always be beaten by those genuinely tall and athletic rucks. He's just a battler and it was horribly exposed last night.

Small forward line has also run its race. Pies had extra in the D50 all night last night and a midfield/wing zone setup that consistently forced us to kick long into the F50.

Missed Butler last night. We looked slow, which is strange.

Need another big-bodied midfielder. Someone 185-190cm and 90kg+ who can do some heavy lifting vs the likes of Pendlebury + Sidebottom etc.

[Francois Jackson]

Nank is a Maric clone and will end his career battered and bruised like Ivan did.

We need a mid and a ruckman. Soldo is not that person

[big tone]

In the perfect world Nank is our ruck/forward and we have a bigger, still agile first ruck that can do more than just tap the footy.

[Tiger Khosh]

In the perfect world Nank is our ruck/forward and we have a bigger, still agile first ruck that can do more than just tap the footy.

Nank used as anything other than no.1 ruck is useless. He is not a good enough fwd to play fwd/ruck, his strength is his work in the middle and yes while he may lose the contest he is an absolute beast in his follow up.

Some of the comments on here are bordering on hysterical. Win the premiership last year finish top this year and now or ruckman ain’t good enough, we need to start tagging oppo mids, small fwd line doesn’t work etc......

We didn’t turn up yesterday as simple as that had nothing to do with our strategy and game style.

[big tone]

In the perfect world Nank is our ruck/forward and we have a bigger, still agile first ruck that can do more than just tap the footy.

Nank used as anything other than no.1 ruck is useless. He is not a good enough fwd to play fwd/ruck, his strength is his work in the middle and yes while he may lose the contest he is an absolute beast in his follow up.

Some of the comments on here are bordering on hysterical. Win the premiership last year finish top this year and now or ruckman ain’t good enough, we need to start tagging oppo mids, small fwd line doesn’t work etc......

We didn’t turn up yesterday as simple as that had nothing to do with our strategy and game style.

No point having a game style that beats most clubs or a ruckman that is good enough against the lower sides, it’s about getting a game style and players that can win you the last game.
The game has changed since last year and so have some clubs, we have deficiencies and we need to address them. And one is the ruck and our second ruck option.


I do agree with you on tagging players though.
What is Graham’s roll if not to be a run with player while he learns more about being a genuine midfielder?

[Tigeritis™©®]

Our midfield was well down last night but the pies played pure footy once they got on the end of a few goals their confidence was sky high there was no stopping them.

But that’s been our game too for most of the year. We got beaten by our own game by a midfield that runs deep. Good quality big bodied mids and they all had a blinder.   

What we lack a pure big bodied midfielder.  I can’t help myself to think if only Betamax called out Patrick Cripps number instead of Lambert’s number because he’s exactly the type we need.

The Clayton Oliver Type bull. Collingwood has a few (Adams, Pendles, Sier, Crisp) that can do this and they can also run and it worked to perfection. It afforded them the luxury of letting Sidebottom (6 contested 35 uncontested) do whatever he wanted providing a link to whatever play they wanted. Thief mids also afforded Treloar to run outside as well.

We don’t have an effective tagger yet but I’m expecting Graham to get better at this. He has the strength and body but just needs the tank to do it for longer and I think he will eventually.
Hopefully Balta can step up as Griggs replacement as an actual effective wingman pinch hitting Ruck.

We need better midfielders. Extractors. Bulls in the middle. We don’t have any.

Unfortunately Caddy might of been the idea in the middle swapping with Dusty but he’s just too slow in today’s game. Good as a second string forward but when Lynch comes in what do we do with Caddy? he’s too slow to be the pressure player we love in the f50. He’s a bull but a very slow one.
If the new rules come in (6,6,6) then I don’t see much of a problem as we will be very hard to stop.

We need a big bodied mid extractor. We have none in the vfl. Rumour has it we have someone lined up in the pipeline but I hear that’s for 2020.
Can we find one for next year?

Prelim team 2018.
Back: Grimes. Rance. Short.   
H/B: Houli. Astbury. Vlastuin.
Centre: Grigg. Cotchin. Edwards.
H/F: Caddy. Riewoldt. Lambert.
Fwds: Castagna. Martin. Rioli.
Rucks: Nankervis. Graham. Prestia.
Interchange: Conca. MacIntosh. Higgins. Broad.

VFL team
Back:Eggmolesse-Smith. Garthwaite. Miller. 
H/B: Markov. Chol. Menadue.
Centre:B.Ellis.*C. Ellis. Balta.
H/F: Butler. Townsend. Bolton
Fwds: Baker. Moore. Stengle.
Rucks: Coleman-Jones. *Lloyd.*Miles
Interchange:Soldo. Drummond. Naish.

*Trade

OUT: Hampson. Griffiths.

Potential 2019.
Back: Grimes. Rance. Short.   
H/B: Markov. Astbury. Vlastuin.
Centre: Balta. Cotchin. Edwards.
H/F: Martin. Riewoldt. Lambert.
Fwds: Butler. Lynch. Rioli.
Rucks: Nankervis. Graham. Prestia.
Interchange: Caddy. MacIntosh. Higgins. Castagna. 

Out: Broad. Conca. (Houli. Grigg) transition.

???? Caddy. What’s his role with Lynch in the side? Too slow for midfield and deficient as a pressure forward because with Lynch in we lose a forward spot. He has done excellent job for us up forward though.

???? Can Balta be the utility we need. Has pace and an excellent leap. Has he the tank to go consistently 4 qtrs?

???  Markov. Can he replace Houli? Or even Broad as the attacking half back? Will he move to a wing.
He had a terrible year with injury with no consistency. I’m expecting big things in 2019. I’d be suprised if he didn’t get a regular afl spot.

Recruiting.
Our depth is good but we need to find a hard bodied midfield extractor but someone that’s got pace too.

Trades: Miles. B.Ellis. Conca. C.Ellis. Lloyd.