Miles and C.Ellis to Gold Coast for a swap of 2019 future 3rd round picks

[Tiger Khosh]

Anyone else noticed we are screwing up a 1st round pick here?
The fact B Ellis was al ost out the door is a worry too.
How many first rounders can you stuff up and still be competitive in the future?

I don’t know, count how many you think we’ve stuffed up and then refer back to our premiership.

[RedanTiger]

Came here to reaffirm my view that we were short changed in the deal, but hmm, a great post by Slipper, an opinion changing post!
We probably could've held out and got an outright 3rd rounder for Ellis, but it would've been a worse pick than the one we are going to get anyway,  if it was Essendon probably 7-8 spots worse.

Yep, same here.
First thought it was a poor deal.
Then factored in the Lynch deal.
Then realized that we got what we could while helping a couple of players.

Bottom line is they could have just been picked up by Suns after we delisted them.
Everybody wins - players, Suns and Richmond plus we get some goodwill for our next raid on them.

[tdy]

Just did a bit of a review we seem to have only a little better than 50 50 hit rate with 1st rounders over the last 6 or 7 years. Gee I hope this new recruiting head is better than FJ.
Misses
C Ellis
B Lennon

Middling
S Bolton though arguably its Dion Prestia a hit but he was a known quantity.

Hits
D Rioli
J Higgins
Vlastuin

[Dougeytherichmondfan]

Just did a bit of a review we seem to have only a little better than 50 50 hit rate with 1st rounders over the last 6 or 7 years. Gee I hope this new recruiting head is better than FJ.
Misses
C Ellis
B Lennon

Middling
S Bolton though arguably its Dion Prestia a hit but he was a known quantity.

Hits
D Rioli
J Higgins
Vlastuin

Probably better to do an analysis like this.

Reiwoldt - Hit
Cotchin - Hit
Rance (EoFR) - Hit
Vickery  - Miss
Martin - Hit
Conca - Miss
Bellis - honestly 50/50. Was a huge contributor during our premiership run. Played the footy we needed when it counted. Also from a compromised draft. Taken at 15. Elliot Yeo taken at 30 probably the only genuine miss
Vlastuin - Hit
Lennon - Miss
CEllis - Miss
Rioli - Hit
(no first rounder 2016)
Higgins  - At this stage Hit. Not 100% convinced he's a lock but can't complain thus far.

You could include Jared O-N if you wanted. I think Jackson started in 2005?

[YellowandBlackBlood]

Fine Eyes was still a full time teacher back then!

What a disgraceful organisation we were back in those days. No wonder we were so poo. Lucky we got Nathan Brown, who for 10 games was as good as any player I have ever seen. Then the broken leg. 

[Dougeytherichmondfan]

Fine Eyes was still a full time teacher back then!

What a disgraceful organisation we were back in those days. No wonder we were so pooe. Lucky we got Nathan Brown, who for 10 games was as good as any player I have ever seen. Then the broken leg. 

Both my folks are teachers, its not a punch in at 9, out at 5 type job.

It is honestly unfathomable that someone was a full time teacher and head of recruiting at the same time in a fully professional era.

Nothing short of disgraceful!

[tdy]

So of the first 7 we get 4.5 hits with 2 of them top 3 picks and thats enough to win a premiership.  Wow. Maybe its a sign of the evenness of the comp.  As a recruiter you'd hope you get better than %50. Also its a sign we traded well. Prestia Nank Caddy Houli etc.

I have a memory of one stage where we had almost the same number of games from our rookie list as our 2nd rounders and down.  I dont think anyone would call our FJ period a great time at the draft.

[Gracie]

Wasn't Lennon and C Ellis taken in compromised drafts? So more like mid second round picks

[YellowandBlackBlood]

Wasn't Lennon and C Ellis taken in compromised drafts? So more like mid second round picks

No. Conca and Bellis.

[big tone]

We got FA for Miles and Cellis.
IMO Miles was worth a pick in the 40 to 50 range
Cellis is worth a pick in the 30 to 40 range IMO.

I know we got Lynch but what has one got to do with the other.
Lynch was a free agent who chose us as his preferred destination.
I understand they could have matched the offer but realistically we couldn’t have given them anywhere near that pick in a great draft. And surely they wouldn’t want a player that clearly doesn’t want to be there.

We finally get some depth at the club and now they are just willing to give it away for next to nothing.

We had better get a decent pick for Lloyd and even Stengle
Lloyd is worth a pick the 30 to 40 range. He could easily play 100 games for a club.
Stengle is worth about the same imo regardless of how many games he has played. He has had 2 years in a success system and could easily become a good AFL footballer.

[Tiger Khosh]

You’ve overrated our players a fair bit there BT.

CEllis has played 27 games in 4 years and really didn’t show anything more than a couple of small glimpses.

Miles is proven at afl level and I sort of agree with your evaluation but you can’t expect to get much for a guy that’s played around 5 games in 2 years.

Lloyd will be 29 by the time next season starts so I think your call of playing 100 games for his next club is a bit of a stretch.

Stengle is a rookie listed player with 2 afl games to his name.

While I would love to get 3rd rounders for all those players fact of the matter is they are all depth players starved of opportunity at afl level. Combination of goodwill towards the players and the fact that they are out of contract and are pretty much garaunteed to get to the clubs by way of the drafts means that we unfortunately take what we can get.

[Tiger Khosh]

Just did a bit of a review we seem to have only a little better than 50 50 hit rate with 1st rounders over the last 6 or 7 years. Gee I hope this new recruiting head is better than FJ.
Misses
C Ellis
B Lennon

Middling
S Bolton though arguably its Dion Prestia a hit but he was a known quantity.

Hits
D Rioli
J Higgins
Vlastuin

Probably better to do an analysis like this.

Reiwoldt - Hit
Cotchin - Hit
Rance (EoFR) - Hit
Vickery  - Miss
Martin - Hit
Conca - Miss
Bellis - honestly 50/50. Was a huge contributor during our premiership run. Played the footy we needed when it counted. Also from a compromised draft. Taken at 15. Elliot Yeo taken at 30 probably the only genuine miss
Vlastuin - Hit
Lennon - Miss
CEllis - Miss
Rioli - Hit
(no first rounder 2016)
Higgins  - At this stage Hit. Not 100% convinced he's a lock but can't complain thus far.

You could include Jared O-N if you wanted. I think Jackson started in 2005?

You forgot lachie Neale taken in the third round. But honestly as much as people lay into him, I don’t see how you can call a 150+ game premiership player and life member of the club a miss.

People also have unrealistic expectations, if we got the best player available (in hindsight) with all our first round picks how exactly we would fit them all into the salary cap considering we’re close to making out as is?

[Francois Jackson]

Just did a bit of a review we seem to have only a little better than 50 50 hit rate with 1st rounders over the last 6 or 7 years. Gee I hope this new recruiting head is better than FJ.
Misses
C Ellis
B Lennon

Middling
S Bolton though arguably its Dion Prestia a hit but he was a known quantity.

Hits
D Rioli
J Higgins
Vlastuin

Probably better to do an analysis like this.

Reiwoldt - Hit
Cotchin - Hit
Rance (EoFR) - Hit
Vickery  - Miss
Martin - Hit
Conca - Miss
Bellis - honestly 50/50. Was a huge contributor during our premiership run. Played the footy we needed when it counted. Also from a compromised draft. Taken at 15. Elliot Yeo taken at 30 probably the only genuine miss
Vlastuin - Hit
Lennon - Miss
CEllis - Miss
Rioli - Hit
(no first rounder 2016)
Higgins  - At this stage Hit. Not 100% convinced he's a lock but can't complain thus far.

You could include Jared O-N if you wanted. I think Jackson started in 2005?

You forgot lachie Neale taken in the third round. But honestly as much as people lay into him, I don’t see how you can call a 150+ game premiership player and life member of the club a miss.

People also have unrealistic expectations, if we got the best player available (in hindsight) with all our first round picks how exactly we would fit them all into the salary cap considering we’re close to making out as is?

i agree tiger khosh. bellis may be a lot of things but i do know one thing. We were pantsed in a final he didnt play in

was a fine contributor in our premiership year yet he was a miss. 

[Dougeytherichmondfan]

I know we got Lynch but what has one got to do with the other.
Lynch was a free agent who chose us as his preferred destination.
I understand they could have matched the offer but realistically we couldn’t have given them anywhere near that pick in a great draft. And surely they wouldn’t want a player that clearly doesn’t want to be there.

And that there is what people can't quite understand.

If we weren't willing to make the exact trade we did Miles and Ellis and the exchange of picks then GC would match the bid for Lynch and we are forced to trade.

Which makes them inextricably linked, despite being separate deals.

So yes, we could have played hard ball and maybe made GC sweat. But would we honestly, really, want to risk bringing in the perfect target that we have been working on for 2+ years for a measly extra second rounder?

C'mon guys, get a grip.

[WilliamPowell]

I know we got Lynch but what has one got to do with the other.
Lynch was a free agent who chose us as his preferred destination.
I understand they could have matched the offer but realistically we couldn’t have given them anywhere near that pick in a great draft. And surely they wouldn’t want a player that clearly doesn’t want to be there.

And that there is what people can't quite understand.

If we weren't willing to make the exact trade we did Miles and Ellis and the exchange of picks then GC would match the bid for Lynch and we are forced to trade.

Which makes them inextricably linked, despite being separate deals.

So yes, we could have played hard ball and maybe made GC sweat. But would we honestly, really, want to risk bringing in the perfect target that we have been working on for 2+ years for a measly extra second rounder?

C'mon guys, get a grip.

the other thing is both of these players like Lloyd; are out of contract 31 Oct. So if we don't trade we get nothing for them as they would become delisted free agents.

And I still think in the case of Miles; we repaid the guy for some loyalty who could left last year but stuck around. Promised we'd get him to his club of his choice and we did. CEllis (IMHO) was worth a 4th rounder at best - been a huge disappointment especially this year