Noah Cumberland [merged]

[camboon]

BS not the way Cumberland was singled out and now he is playing a role that is killing his attacking confidence, same Dan r, Buttler , Higgins, etc

[Tiger Khosh]

I find the lengths people are going to, to find reasons for his poor peformances pretty bizarre. He’s out of form and as much as people want to deny it that’s mainly on him. He’s not being played out of position or asked to do something out of left field, he’s being asked to pressure and tackle, that’s literally one of the key roles of anyone outside of a key forward.

[Willy]

I find the lengths people are going to, to find reasons for his poor peformances pretty bizarre. He’s out of form and as much as people want to deny it that’s mainly on him. He’s not being played out of position or asked to do something out of left field, he’s being asked to pressure and tackle, that’s literally one of the key roles of anyone outside of a key forward.

Completely agree.

Real over the top stuff in this thread.

[WilliamPowell]

I find the lengths people are going to, to find reasons for his poor peformances pretty bizarre. He’s out of form and as much as people want to deny it that’s mainly on him. He’s not being played out of position or asked to do something out of left field, he’s being asked to pressure and tackle, that’s literally one of the key roles of anyone outside of a key forward.

Great post

Totally agree

[camboon]

No one denies he is out of form but ask why he is and why a coach thinks it’s ok to bag his own players publicly
And if he will join the other of small forwards that have left the club or were reinvented

[WilliamPowell]

No one denies he is out of form but ask why he is and why a coach thinks it’s ok to bag his own players publicly
And if he will join the other of small forwards that have left the club or were reinvented

Are we asking why other players out of form? No. It seems to be just Noah

I actually don't think he was "bagged" as badly as some think he was. Think it was also mentioned in the same presser how good this kid can be if he wants badly enough.

There was a little dig at Shai yesterday but I don't see or hear people going overboard about that.

Noah is horribly out of form. I think what gets lost in this discussion is that in all his games this season he has gone missing. And that was before the infamous presser.

[Tiger Khosh]

“He can be as good as he wants, that kid, but he’s got to get to work on some things in his game, and a lot of that has to do with Noah, how bad he wants it, and he’s working on that, he’ll get better,” Hardwick said.

“I was really happy with the vast majority of his game tonight. We sort of changed our structure a little bit to get him in, he’s just got to continue to play the game and realise the game will challenge him at various stages.

“His body language will get better, but we just love what he brings, his energy.”

Are these the comments everyone is up in arms about? Those are some incredibly tame comments. If that’s really people’s excuse, then I don’t know what to say.

[camboon]

Other coaches don’t bag their own players publicly but  I guess his loss of confidence has nothing to do with that .
I note, We don’t have a good track record with retaining  small forward’s under Dimma who seems to be hard on them
Some of those same small seem to be going well at their new club but couldn’t get a regular game at Richmond  or retired or moved to another position, but thinking Cumberland is going true same way is probably a coincidence
 

[Tiger Khosh]

If you don’t think other coaches make similar comments about their players then I’d suggest watching some other press conferences. What did Dimma really say that was so bad? To summarise; the skys the limit with him but he’s gotta want it for himself and he can see he’s working on it. I just don’t get the big fuss that’s being made about it here.

And let’s go through the small forwards you listed that Dimma doesn’t have a good track record with:

- Dan Rioli: 5 seasons as a small forward including 3 premierships. Fell out of form in season 6 and was moved to half back where he has been a revelation and signed a new long term deal with the club.

- Dan Butler: 3 seasons as a small forward including 1 premiership. Fell out of favour and requested a trade to st kilda. After a red hot start with 21 goals in his first 10 games, has averaged under a goal a game. He is an ok player but hardly setting the world on fire. Was essentially replaced by Bolton in our second premiership side who I don’t think anyone can argue is a vastly superior player.

- Jack Higgins: 3 seasons as a small forward where he was in and out of the side and suffered a serious brain injury during that period. Decided after 3 seasons that he wanted more regular game time and requested a trade to his boyhood club st kilda where he is doing very well this season. Would be quite the stretch to put this one on Dimma. We were right in the middle of our dynasty when he was drafted and it’s no surprise he couldn’t lock down a spot over the premiership players.

[Knighter]

Other coaches don’t bag their own players publicly but  I guess his loss of confidence has nothing to do with that .
I note, We don’t have a good track record with retaining  small forward’s under Dimma who seems to be hard on them
Some of those same small seem to be going well at their new club but couldn’t get a regular game at Richmond  or retired or moved to another position, but thinking Cumberland is going true same way is probably a coincidence

We've only lost Stengle and Butler who couldn't get a game and Higgins who was not Richmond man material.

[camboon]

Lol, none of them are currently small forwards at Richmond , that’s the point! We don’t have any specialist small forwards now apart form Cumberland , whys that when we had too many a couple of years ago?
  I listen to other coaches and they rarely bag their own players , give me some examples of where they unload on their own players . Good Clubs do it in private!
Butler wasn’t offered a contract with Richmond and Higgins went because he was in the twos regularly  and  wanted more senior game time and St Kilda chased him. 
Bolton is not a full time specialist forward.

[Tiger Khosh]

Why do you keep saying he unloaded on his players? The quotes are above how in anyone’s definition does that equate to unloading? He’s literally praising him for 90% of it, just says he needs to work harder. Can you list out those good coaches for me and then which ones have won 3 flags?

[yandb]

Noah's replacement Mansell did no better so why do the coaches pick Noah's replacement as the sub.

Mansell is the most limited player on our list so if you pick him as a sub he is only going to replace Noah. ( he can't play any other position )

Ordinary kick, ordinary backman, ordinary forward.

If Mansell is the sub it sends a message to Noah we have your replacement waiting to go.

Did anyone see Hardwicks reaction when Noah fumbled the ball on the wing, I wonder if it was Mansell fumbling if the  the reaction would have been the same.

[Francois Jackson]

bingo yandb. Said it on here yesterday.

IMO i would have no real issue with what he said IF its consistent. Mansell is terrible what has he done? MRJ hasnt exactly set the world on fire but it wouldnt be pc to say the same to an aboriginal now would it. senior players etc

Few comments on here come as no surprise considering they never liked the guy since day one anyway.

Also If our small forwards were such an issue perhaps Dimma needs to look at our diabolical recruiting of late and call out some of those clowns.

[Gracie]

Noah's replacement Mansell did no better so why do the coaches pick Noah's replacement as the sub.

Mansell is the most limited player on our list so if you pick him as a sub he is only going to replace Noah. ( he can't play any other position )

Ordinary kick, ordinary backman, ordinary forward.

If Mansell is the sub it sends a message to Noah we have your replacement waiting to go.

Did anyone see Hardwicks reaction when Noah fumbled the ball on the wing, I wonder if it was Mansell fumbling if the  the reaction would have been the same.

Maybe it is a case of Hardwick having higher expectations of Cumberland than he does for Mansell