Author Topic: State of Umpiring [merged]  (Read 295295 times)

Offline one-eyed

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #930 on: August 14, 2017, 04:02:34 AM »
From Robbo's 'dislikes' column:

3. COME ON, DIMMA

Have a look at the free kick count, Damien Hardwick said in the post-match. His point might be valid, but it smacked of being a sore loser. Apportioning blame to umpires - and them being influenced by the crowd - for what happened on Saturday was the emotional Hardwick speaking. The free kick count was 28-17 after being 20-7 at half-time. The “noise of affirmation’’ might have been in play, but the Tigers had greater problems than the umpires.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/expert-opinion/mark-robinson/the-tackle-mark-robinson-looks-at-round-21s-highlights-and-lowlights/news-story/b7212b9b4f0a5f449cc010a8ab6baf10

Offline Owl

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #931 on: August 14, 2017, 07:42:07 AM »
yeah the 20 - 7 didn't suck the wind out of our sails at all blobbo
Lots of people name their swords......

dwaino

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #932 on: August 14, 2017, 10:13:48 AM »
A bit hard when the other team are given kicks wrapped in a bow right in front of goal in a game decided by less than three goals.

Online Hard Roar Tiger

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #933 on: August 14, 2017, 11:51:19 AM »
A bit hard when the other team are given kicks wrapped in a bow right in front of goal in a game decided by less than three goals.

Exactly
“I find it nearly impossible to make those judgments, but he is certainly up there with the really important ones, he is certainly up there with the Francis Bourkes and the Royce Harts and the Kevin Bartlett and the Kevin Sheedys, there is no doubt about that,” Balme said.

Offline Simonator

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #934 on: August 14, 2017, 12:16:25 PM »
If they quoted his whole interview he went on to say it's the same for us when we play at the g..

Offline sugark

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #935 on: August 14, 2017, 01:20:00 PM »
If they quoted his whole interview he went on to say it's the same for us when we play at the g..

If they did that then they wouldn't have hours of radio time and countless newspaper articles to fill, never let the facts get in the way of a good story

Offline one-eyed

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AFL umpires boss plays down talk of home crowd influence at Geelong (Age)
« Reply #936 on: August 14, 2017, 10:46:19 PM »
AFL umpires boss Peter Schwab plays down talk of home crowd influence at Geelong

Daniel Cherny
The Age
14 August 2017


AFL umpires chief Peter Schwab says he won't buy into talk umpires are swayed by crowd noise after Richmond coach Damien Hardwick pointed to Geelong's home ground advantage for a free kick discrepancy in the Cats' 14-point win over the Tigers at Simonds Stadium on Saturday.

With Richmond already unhappy about being made to play their blockbuster at Geelong's fortress, Hardwick's angst was exacerbated by a 28-17 free kick tally in the home side's favour.

"The home crowd gets behind them - have a look at the free-kick count," Hardwick said.

However Schwab - who earlier this year said umpires were not specifically trained to deal with crowd noise - reiterated that it was not an issue, suggesting that it was unhelpful to focus raw free kick numbers.

"I think from our point of view, a lopsided free kick count isn't an issue," Schwab told Fairfax Media.

"A lot of clubs always talk about this so-called noise of affirmation which means the crowd has an influence. Personally I don't buy into it. I don't buy into the free kick count. The umpires go out and umpire on the basis of how the game unfolds. And they'll pay free kicks according to whether it's a free kick or not a free kick in their opinion.

"So the free kick count might be lopsided but that's no indication those free kicks aren't there or aren't correct. All I ever say is, if we're making errors, we need to look into why those errors occur.

"But there's no way known from an integrity point of view that the umpires ever look at the free kick count.

"It just can't factor in, because they're too busy umpiring the game. That's the way umpiring's always been."

It had been suggested that Hardwick could receive a 'please explain' from AFL football operations boss Andrew Dillon about the matter, and Schwab was reluctant to be drawn on whether Hardwick should receive such a notice.

"As for Damien getting a 'please explain,' that doesn't fall across my agenda," Schwab said.

"Ultimately Damien and I can always have a chat about the game and whether the free kicks were there or not. That's a legitimate conversation that we can have."

The AFL said no decision would be made on the matter until after the league's regular Monday meeting.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-umpires-boss-peter-schwab-plays-down-talk-of-home-crowd-influence-at-geelong-20170813-gxv3nh.html

Offline one-eyed

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Robert Walls not impressed by Damien Hardwick's post-match comments (Fox)
« Reply #937 on: August 14, 2017, 10:49:07 PM »
Robert Walls not impressed by Damien Hardwick's post-match comments after Richmond loss

Ben Waterworth
FOX SPORTS
August 14, 2017 6:05pm



CARLTON premiership great Robert Walls has blasted Richmond coach Damien Hardwick for his cheeky post-match comments after Saturday’s loss to Geelong.

In front of a parochial home crowd of 32,266 fans at Simonds Stadium, the Cats upset Hardwick’s Tigers by 14 points in an entertaining battle. But by game’s end, the free kick count was 28-17 in favour of Geelong.

Asked if Geelong had the biggest home ground advantage in the AFL when playing at Simonds Stadium, Hardwick said: “Absolutely ... the home crowd gets behind them. Have a look at the free kick count.

“It is what it is. What I will say is you’ve got a significant home ground advantage. I understand what (Geelong coach) Chris (Scott) is saying, I’d be playing as many home games here as I can. It is tough to play.”

But Walls wasn’t a fan of Hardwick’s remarks during his press conference, saying the Tigers coach was “better than that”.

“I think it’s OK for him to think that, but I don’t think you say it,” Walls told Fox Sports News’ AFL Tonight.

“I don’t think it’s good for his players to hear the coach say ‘we were given a raw deal by the umpires’ — you’re better than that.

“You’ve got to be able to play anyone at anytime anywhere and not be concerned about the umpires.:”

Walls, who led four teams during his 336-game coaching career, noted that Hardwick was emotional after such a huge top-four clash.

“It was a big build-up game for Richmond, a game which everyone expected them to win,” Walls said.

“They didn’t and I just think you button your lip and don’t talk about those sorts of things.”

Asked if Hardwick would regret those comments down the track, Walls said: “I think so. I’d be surprised if he did it again.”

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/robert-walls-not-impressed-by-damien-hardwicks-postmatch-comments-after-richmond-loss/news-story/872cd03f4e58522a3b963309eb215269

dwaino

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #938 on: August 14, 2017, 11:03:03 PM »
Still not a single mention of Mackie's deliberate rushed behind. Coaches have commented on umpiring more than once this season, even Max Gawn had a cheeky jibe at them on the weekend. There is a problem and the AFL needs to address it instead of telling everyone to shut up or cop a fine.

Online Andyy

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #939 on: August 15, 2017, 06:54:37 PM »
The umpiring was disgraceful

Offline Owl

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #940 on: August 15, 2017, 10:33:07 PM »
who cares what Robert rosie leaf my starfish Walls says?
Lots of people name their swords......

Offline one-eyed

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Was Richmond really hard done by with free kicks against Geelong? (H-Sun)
« Reply #941 on: August 16, 2017, 02:06:33 AM »
Was Richmond really hard done by with free kicks against Geelong at Simonds Stadium?

CHRIS VERNUCCIO,
Herald Sun
August 15, 2017 4:15pm


RICHMOND coach Damien Hardwick chose his words carefully when asked about the impact the Geelong crowd had in his team’s loss at Simonds Stadium.

The Tigers were on the wrong end of a lopsided 28-17 free kick count last Saturday, which Hardwick pointed out after the game.

“Absolutely ... the home crowd gets behind them. Have a look at the free kick count.”

“It is what it is. What I will say is you’ve got a significant home ground advantage.”

While there was no reference to umpires or umpiring decisions, the inference was the vocal Geelong crowd swayed the men in lime green.

But after the emotion subsides, which it should have by now, Hardwick will be fully aware the discrepancy in the free kick tally had little to do with the “the noise of affirmation”.

A Herald Sun review of the match noted clear decisions that went against the Tigers, some of which were influenced by the crowd, but the Cats also on the wrong end of umpiring errors.

But what was apparently obvious was how much more effective the Cats were with their tackles, which Champion Data stats support.

Geelong laid 72 tackles from 105 attempts, an efficiency of 69 per cent, and missed just six tackles.

Richmond had 147 tackling attempts, effecting 84 tackles — 12 more than the Cats — but its efficiency was 57 per cent and the Tigers missed 13 tackles.

The Tigers weren’t able to make them stick as well as the Cats, and allowed their opponents to get a disposal away.

That was the biggest factor in the result.

Richmond still won its share of holding the ball decisions — seven to Geelong’s 11.

However, when it comes to tackling Geelong is clearly the No.1 team in the competition with an efficiency of 71.1 per cent — the only club about 70 per cent.

The next best is the Western Bulldogs at 68.8 per cent. Richmond’s efficiency is 64.9 per cent, ranked 14th.

The Cats also win the most holding the ball free kicks — 5.7 a game. Sydney is behind them with 5.2.

Here are some of the key moments from Saturday’s game at the Cattery:

FIRST QUARTER

18min44sec: Kane Lambert tackles Cats defender Andrew Mackie from behind, crowd wants a push back but the umpire correctly awards a holding the ball free to the Tigers. The end result is the game’s opening goal to Josh Caddy.

16:26: Tigers ruckman Ivan Soldo gets lucky when he’s tackled by Sam Menengola and drops the ball as Cats fans cry “baaaaall”, but the umpire waves play on.

13:59: Geelong tall Rhys Stanley denied a shot at goal despite David Astbury not having his eyes on the ball and making contact with his face attempting to spoil. Daniel Menzel picks up the loose ball and snaps the Cats’ first score — a behind.

11:45: Stanley gets a square-up free as Astbury hangs on to him, and boots Geelong’s first goal.

8:14: Mackie gets away with an obvious deliberate rushed behind after handballing to Lachie Henderson, who was already behind the goal line. The Tigers cheer squad behind the goals is ropeable.

SECOND QUARTER

19:14: The Tigers again start a quarter with the first goal from a free kick after Geelong defender Zach Tuohy was deemed to have thrown the ball in a Dan Butler tackle.

13:40: Geelong’s midfield press is forcing the Tigers to overhandball. Shane Edwards breaks a tackle and handballs to Daniel Rioli who tries to sell the dummy but is nabbed by Menengola.

7:22: Martin nudges Jordan Murdoch under the ball inside Richmond’s forward 50, there’s a murmur from the crowd but the umps aren’t interested.

5:45: Sam Simpson gets the benefit of the doubt after a dubious disposal when tackled by Nathan Broad.

5:38: Broad puts his head down between two Geelong players to win the ball and is taken high but doesn’t receive a free.

5:30: Mackie is all over Jack Riewoldt 10m from goal. Riewoldt is furious no free was paid. Crucial moment with the Tigers trailing 41-29.

4:37: Up the other end, Menzel is impeded by Brandon Ellis in a marking content. Menzel goal’s is effectively a 12-point turnaround.

3:57: The Tigers apply pressure at a centre bounce. Murdoch tries to spin out of trouble but is collared by Richmond captain Trent Cotchin. The ball spills but the umpire keeps the whistle away.

2:32: Grigg is under pressure in defence as he throws the ball onto his boot. It bounces between the 50m arc and the centre square and bounces another five times before going out of bounds. The vocal Geelong crowd scream for deliberate and get it. Harsh decision.

00:04: Menzel is dragged down Edwards, stopping a certain shot at goal on the siren, but seconds earlier Cotchin made high contact with the Cats forward.

THIRD QUARTER

16:16: Dangerfield marks on the 50 to crowd cheers, but is ruled to have pushed Dion Prestia in the back.

13:04: Jackson Thurlow is dumped after a strong tackle by McIntosh, and it’s questionable whether the Cat got a handball away.

10:35: Prestia is pounced on by Cam Guthrie and Selwood at a centre bounce. The crowd appeals for a free but the umpire correctly rules there was no prior opportunity.

8:06: Guthrie fumbles the ball before he’s tackled by Broad. He had prior opportunity and also didn’t dispose the ball correctly. Clear mistake.

6:02: Riewoldt is pushed by Tom Lonergan outside 50m and is the awarded the free. Delivers a pinpoint pass to Houli, who goals to cut the margin to 13 points.

2:00: Cats defender Jackson Thurlow is in the back pocket and under little pressure dribbles the ball towards the boundary line. Deliberate out of bounds paid.

FOURTH QUARTER

9:21: Rioli gathers the bouncing ball and is immediately seized by Selwood. The umpire waits before calling holding the ball. With the Cats 20 point up, the crowd is getting louder.

7:42: Selwood is tackled by Prestia as soon as he takes possession, in similar circumstances to the Rioli tackle previously. The only difference is Selwood had one armed pin and lets the ball spill out, but that’s incorrect disposal.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/richmond/was-richmond-really-hard-done-by-with-free-kicks-against-geelong-at-simonds-stadium/news-story/1384bb16e671da1f07d34ea7b71337ec

dwaino

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #942 on: August 16, 2017, 07:43:35 AM »
Wtf does that article even achieve? Only seems to show where we get away with a few and the obvious ones Geelong deserved while managing to conveniently ignore the others. Then it also mentions crap like second quarter 4:37 which during the replay showed Menzel didn't even deserve a free kick. Many of those HTB didn't even have prior opportunity but were still paid after a pause from the umpires which is what Hardwick was referring to with his "noise of affirmation" comment. Rubbish article.

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #943 on: August 16, 2017, 10:03:01 AM »
Chris Venereal.............another hillbilly with no idea

Offline one-eyed

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Re: State of Umpiring [merged]
« Reply #944 on: August 16, 2017, 01:01:30 PM »
Caroline Wilson criticises Richmond coach Damien Hardwick over ‘mean-spirited’ umpiring complaint

By WWOS staff
16 August 2017


Footy Classified’s Caroline Wilson has ripped into coach Damien Hardwick’s "mean-spirited" claim that AFL umpires favoured Geelong in Richmond’s Round 21 loss.

The free kick count was 28-17 in favour of the Cats, which Hardwick pointed out as part of the “significant home ground advantage” Geelong held when playing at Simonds Stadium.

“The home crowd gets behind them, have a look at the free kick count,” Hardwick said.

“They’re an outstanding side, but they’re an outstanding side plus when it comes to playing here.”

Though Hardwick didn’t blame the 80-66 defeat solely on the skewed free kick count, Wilson hit out at the coach’s unnecessary shot at the umpires.

“Damien, what were you thinking?” Wilson said on the ‘Caro’s Arrow’ segment on Nine’s Footy Classified.

“Who do you coaches actually talk to when you speak like that at post match press conferences? To your players? To your supporters? Maybe it’s political? Maybe you’re sending a message to the umpires? Are you worried the same thing will happen against Fremantle at Subiaco next week? Or at the Adelaide Oval during the finals?”

Coming into the game against Geelong, the Tigers were brimming with confidence having soundly beaten Hawthorn 93-64 the previous week.  Wilson thought Hardwick’s complaints were a disappointing turn.

“In the context of what was a great week and a great build up for the Richmond Football Club it just seemed a little unsporting, a little negative, irrelevant and dare I say it Damien, mean-spirited,” Wilson said.

However fellow Footy Classified panellist and Essendon legend Matthew Lloyd appreciated Hardwick’s honesty.

“I agreed with him,” the 2000 AFL Premiership winner said.

“I thought Geelong got the rub of the green early and Damien Hardwick was just being honest.”

http://wwos.nine.com.au/2017/08/15/15/14/caroline-wilson-criticises-richmond-coach-damien-hardwick-umpires