Shaun Hampson / Hammertime [merged]

[TigerLand]

McBean is a promising footballer in the VFl, he has a long way to go before we can bank him as a great draft pick.

I think after the year he had in the VFL as a 1st year player and a KPP at pick 33 I think its OK to say, at this present time the selection has been justified.

Unless we can't comment on players until they've finished there careers whats the point of having an opinion on anyone...

My point is that there are players like Liam McBean who get picked at pick 33 and are capable of having a season in the VFL like he did and show great promise. In comparison to someone like Hampson who after 7 years at Carlton managed 63 uneventful games.

How else can you compare a hypothetical pick 28 lol?

[yellowandback]

I would just wait a few years to see how far he progresses.
My point would be he has done SFA at senior level and we as supporters have a track record of putting the cart before the horse - whenever I heard the words "cult figure" and "Richmond footballer" in the same sentence I shudder.
Not saying he can't or won't make it, just that he's only shown some promise in an ordinary state competition which isn't enough to prove a point about the worth of a second round draft pick.

[TigerLand]

on what basis do you think that Carlton were willing to accept our third round pick?

On the basis that he's a crap footballer and the fact that he hasn't held down a best 22 spot in an average Carlton line up.

The fact that McBean was pick 33 shows that picks in the late 20s and early 30s are highly valuable. Understand this draft is quite shallow but Hampson is not worth a McBean pick.

i doubt you come come with stuffed up logic you tried

I'm sorry can you rephrase that? How else would you have liked me to answer the question?

Carlton are in a big overhaul of their list and Hampson was unlikely to be required and they would have taken a lower pick to get rid of Hampson?

Take a look at his stats he's played 7 years, highest amount of games played in a season is 15. Concerning with form/injury prone. In the last 4 seasons he's played a total of 36 games.. 4 season between 21 and 25 years of age = 36 games. Thats 1 and a third of a season...

Avgs 15 hit outs across his career and 16 hit outs over the past 4 years. You could argue he's 2nd string ruckman so that isn't too bad for a 2nd stringer or a FWD/RUCKMAN. Combine those average/OK stats with his goal kicking ability - which is a pretty ordinary avg of 0.5 goals a game. With a shooting for goal accuracy % of 55% which doesn't include shots that didn't make the distance and out on the full.

Compare him to Ivan Maric who we got for pick 37 who came in 2012 after Sam Jacobs took number 1 ruck spot in 2011. Maric played every game in 2009 and 2010 as the main ruckman averaging 19 hit outs a game and 0.4 goals a game. Not earth shattering numbers but better than Jacobs. Certainly with the fact that he played 2 full seasons of AFL, something Hampson has not been able to do. Sure Maric was 2nd string to Jacobs and only played 6 games in his last year which is similar to Jacobs last year at Carlton.

Add the fact that Carlton are absolute scum, we've given up a 2nd round draft pick far too easily and quickly for a player who is very average.

Should have been a 3rd rounder and its a 50-50 trade.

[TigerLand]

I would just wait a few years to see how far he progresses.
My point would be he has done SFA at senior level and we as supporters have a track record of putting the cart before the horse - whenever I heard the words "cult figure" and "Richmond footballer" in the same sentence I shudder.
Not saying he can't or won't make it, just that he's only shown some promise in an ordinary state competition which isn't enough to prove a point about the worth of a second round draft pick.

Agree with that completely but in terms of analysing a 1st year player, surely we can have the opinion that over the past 12 months McBean has shown that he has been a clever pick 33 and shows promise?

The point I was trying to make is simply that whilst some people don't rate picks 25+ there are still players that are talented if all the stars align and we shouldn't be throwing away 2nd round draft picks for a packet of used twisties.

[Penelope]

How else can you compare a hypothetical pick 28 lol?

LOL for sure.
well you could look at all the players taken around that pick over a period of time, and look at the success rate.

Or you could do what you have, take one first year player who has shown promise at a lower level but is is yet to even play AFL, deem that an outstanding success while ignoring the countless failures to come to the conclusion that the pick does indeed have great value

[RedanTiger]

on what basis do you think that Carlton were willing to accept our third round pick?

On the basis that he's a crap footballer and the fact that he hasn't held down a best 22 spot in an average Carlton line up.

The fact that McBean was pick 33 shows that picks in the late 20s and early 30s are highly valuable. Understand this draft is quite shallow but Hampson is not worth a McBean pick.

So why didn't you use the McIntosh pick, it was 31 and thus closer and thus more representative of the value of the traded pick 28.
Or the pick 28 from 2012 - Tim O'Brien
or from 2011 - Fraser McInnes.
or from 2010 - Ryan Lester.

[bojangles17]

on what basis do you think that Carlton were willing to accept our third round pick?

On the basis that he's a crap footballer and the fact that he hasn't held down a best 22 spot in an average Carlton line up.

The fact that McBean was pick 33 shows that picks in the late 20s and early 30s are highly valuable. Understand this draft is quite shallow but Hampson is not worth a McBean pick.

i doubt you come come with stuffed up logic you tried

I'm sorry can you rephrase that? How else would you have liked me to answer the question?

Carlton are in a big overhaul of their list and Hampson was unlikely to be required and they would have taken a lower pick to get rid of Hampson?

Take a look at his stats he's played 7 years, highest amount of games played in a season is 15. Concerning with form/injury prone. In the last 4 seasons he's played a total of 36 games.. 4 season between 21 and 25 years of age = 36 games. Thats 1 and a third of a season...

Avgs 15 hit outs across his career and 16 hit outs over the past 4 years. You could argue he's 2nd string ruckman so that isn't too bad for a 2nd stringer or a FWD/RUCKMAN. Combine those average/OK stats with his goal kicking ability - which is a pretty ordinary avg of 0.5 goals a game. With a shooting for goal accuracy % of 55% which doesn't include shots that didn't make the distance and out on the full.

Compare him to Ivan Maric who we got for pick 37 who came in 2012 after Sam Jacobs took number 1 ruck spot in 2011. Maric played every game in 2009 and 2010 as the main ruckman averaging 19 hit outs a game and 0.4 goals a game. Not earth shattering numbers but better than Jacobs. Certainly with the fact that he played 2 full seasons of AFL, something Hampson has not been able to do. Sure Maric was 2nd string to Jacobs and only played 6 games in his last year which is similar to Jacobs last year at Carlton.

Add the fact that Carlton are absolute scum, we've given up a 2nd round draft pick far too easily and quickly for a player who is very average.

Should have been a 3rd rounder and its a 50-50 trade.

Would not have got the deal done, haw were circling. Facts are his form stacks up better than Marics did prior to joining us. Hammer can leap and clunks his marks , he can play a bit just quietly, roll the tape and watch his highlights

[Gigantor]

From what I understand Bo has very reliable contacts within the bowels of the HFC ,so hes probably on the money here

[1965]

Would not have got the deal done, haw were circling. Facts are his form stacks up better than Marics did prior to joining us. Hammer can leap and clunks his marks , he can play a bit just quietly, roll the tape and watch his highlights

What tape.

In fact what is tape old man?

 

[bojangles17]

Would not have got the deal done, haw were circling. Facts are his form stacks up better than Marics did prior to joining us. Hammer can leap and clunks his marks , he can play a bit just quietly, roll the tape and watch his highlights

What tape.

In fact what is tape old man?

 

It's a metaphor for looking at the highlights reel  u silly bugger

[1965]

It's a metaphor for looking at the highlights reel  u silly bugger

"Highlights reel" makes you even older.

over 85yo at least

 

[TigerLand]

How else can you compare a hypothetical pick 28 lol?

LOL for sure.
well you could look at all the players taken around that pick over a period of time, and look at the success rate.

Or you could do what you have, take one first year player who has shown promise at a lower level but is is yet to even play AFL, deem that an outstanding success while ignoring the countless failures to come to the conclusion that the pick does indeed have great value

Sure... if you want a history lesson and 1 example wasn't good enough, we can go back to a year earlier than McBean draft with Hawthorns Pick 33 selection in Brad Hill. Now premiership player.

Year before that 2010 draft, you may have heard of Jeremy Howe at Pick 33. Or Jack Darling at Pick 26.

2009 Draft, Mitch Duncan at 28, another premiership player. Another premiership player in Jack Gunston at pick 29, and unlucky not to be a Norm Smith Medalist.

2008 draft, Dayne Beams at pick 28. You guessed it another premiership player and All Australian mind you. Pick 30, Dan Hannerbury, premiership player and All Australian. Liam Shiels Pick 33, yet another premiership player.

I could go on... open your eyes mate. I look forward to your response trying to suggest Hampson is even close to any of those players mentioned.

[Penelope]

that is not what i am saying.
Once again you are ignoring all the failures and just cherry picking the few successes.

It is even debatable if being a premiership player alone is a guide to how sucessful the draft pick is, as there are premiership players who do not have long carreers.

But that distracts from the important point that you are not looking at the overall success rate, just bringing a few names out.

It's not my eyes that need opening, they are wide open and can see the whole picture, not just the snippets that suit me.

[Damo]

2010 Draft
2   27       North Melbourne   Kieran Harper   North Melbourne   40
2   28       Brisbane   Ryan Lester   Brisbane   38
2   29       West Coast   Scott Lycett   West Coast   10
2   30       Richmond   Jake Batchelor   Richmond   39
2   31       Essendon   Ariel Steinberg   Essendon   0
2   32       Brisbane   Joshua Green   Brisbane   34

2011 Draft
1   26       Richmond   Todd Elton   Richmond   1
    27    Priority   Adelaide   Sam Kerridge   Adelaide   12
    28    Priority   West Coast   Fraser McInnes   West Coast   0
    29    Priority   Fremantle   Alex Forster   Fremantle   1
    30    Compensation   Brisbane   Elliot Yeo   Brisbane   27
2   31       Essendon   Jackson Merrett   Essendon   14
2   32       Geelong   Joel Hamling   Geelong   0

2012 Draft
2   27       GWS   James Stewart   GWS   1
2   28       Hawthorn   Tim O'Brien   Hawthorn   0
2   29       Port Adelaide   Tom Clurey   Port Adelaide   0
2   30       Port Adelaide   Mason Shaw   Port Adelaide   0
2   31       Richmond   Kamdyn Mcintosh   Richmond   0
2   32       Brisbane   Michael Close   Brisbane   0


Not really a who's who.

I just went a couple of picks either side of pick 30, which is actually about what we traded (pick 28 will drop a bit after the free agent picks)

[Judge Roughneck]

In what way could Richmond upgrade its unhealthy, weak ruck stocks

 And yet not trade its first or secoubd pick?

If we are looking at state league player what if he's drafted by someone else before our rookie draft pick. What if he's not good enough?

If we draft 18 year old ruxk chances are no impact for these years in senior team. Even longer average two kicks. Hardwick is in topping up mode

Is the risk of going into '14 without a  upgrade ruck division a greater risk than not going for hampson? I don't think anyone reckons we didn't need at least one more ruck