Shaun Hampson / Hammertime [merged]

[tiga]

Did we trade Vickory?
Why do people not include Vickory in ruck conversations?
I'm watching Richmond and St. Kilda on Foxtel now and Vickory is doing ok in the ruck. And i think we all forget that he is still young for a ruckman.
I'm with Claw, could have easily got through 2014 with Maric, Vickory, Big O and maybe another mature rookie ruckman.
And saved our pick 28 odd and got Hampson next year for nothing if we still wanted him as we'll a pretty good junior footballer. Rated 28 best in the land is a pretty good kid.
I must rate Big O's ruck work more than others as well because I think he is the perfect back up and costs us nothing.

Although I understand what you are trying to say, the problem with your suggestion is that if Maric goes down, we will be relying on a 31 yo ruck to see us through the season alone. Vickery is not a ruckman. His hits to advantage are very poor. We would be in the same situation as the second half of the elimination final where the Carlton rucks just kept on palming straight to their midfielders.

Agreed. Just because someone is tall, doesn't make them a ruckman. The club have realised this with VickEry and thus the recruitment of Hampson to make VickEry a permanent Forward option.

[the claw]

Claw

Who would you prefer in the ruck and why?

Good question, but I hope youre not holding your breath. 

why all the snide remarks. if you took the time to find out what ive said on this site ive advocated a fair few ruckmen over recent yrs.

what i dont get is why the ruck situation coulkd not be addressed with a player like jolly if need be. and we keep pick 28. why was it a must to trade out of pick 28 on such a poor performer with such poor stats and with such knocks on basic skills. all this with 7yrs of history.
give me pick 28 and if darcy cameron is there use it on him failing that use it on the best kid available.

people talk as if there was no option but to take hampson and they are wrong.

[the claw]

for those who defend this trade i have to ask.
tell me why its such a good trade based on performance stats and skills.does hampson after 7yrs tick any of these boxes.

just to finish. how many plauyers are there on team lists. lets say roughly 800. every yr we  get an influx of how many new faces?  100 players say!! it would be close give or take 10 or so.

so 70 80 odd of the new faces every yr comes thru the nd and we are turning our noses up at top 30 picks because they are apparently no good. unbelievable.

Ok I'll have a nibble.
Firt of all I have not so much defended the trade, but argued that pick 30 odd is generally overvalued, so i dont belive that we have risked as much as some do.
I've put forward why i feel that way and if anyone can put forward a better method to quantify the value of the pick that does not rely on a subjective valuation of players, I'm all ears.

On Hampson, I haven't seen a lot of him to have formed a solid opinion either way, but from what I have, i do have concerns over his kicking. I wont get excited over what i have seen against us, where he has had some good performance, as it seems that half his highlights package is against us.
By the same token i wont read too much into "only played x games in X years " and "couldnt get a game at Cartlton" Blah blah blah. we saw similar thoughts used against Maric, and it was proven to be arse logic, (who FWIW, couldnt get a game behind Jacobs, who couldnt get a game behind Hampson). No one predicted he would come down with a groin problem like he has, which now means we have probably seen the best of him, nor will we get the length of service we would had hoped.

What i can glean about hampson;

He had a reputation for not holding marks. a couple of years ago it was discovered he had poor eye sight, which was subsequently fixed with laser surgery. Last year he was equal 6th in the league for contested marks per game.

Combine that with leading the league for % of taps to advantage and you have two qualities you want in a ruckman. He is fast for a big man, and does have a good leap.

another issue that supporters have with him has been his consistency, and intensity at times. as we have seen many ruckman don't start playing solid consistent footy until 25. As for intensity, is that just his make up, or is it a confidence thing? As it is not all the time that he lacks intensity, it it is possible that this is just a confidence thing.

He will be 26 when the season starts, so if he is going to play consistent footy to an appropriate level, we should start seeing it pretty much straight away.

One way or another we will know pretty quickly with shaun, as opposed to having to wait 5-6 years for a young ruckman.

For mine the concerns are his injury history and his kicking. On the injury front his two knee injuries were both impact injuries rather than indicating some structural weakness, but the question is have these injuries impacted his speed and leap?

Is his kicking due to the injuries? we have seen how injury has affected maric's kicking and how Jacksons kicking improved after getting over leg problems. In 2012 hampson kicked 15.4, but no other year has he come close to that conversion rate

Again, we should know soon enough.

thats a great response im short for time atm in fact may not be back on for a week or so. but i will attempt to make a decent reply to this.

i think at the end of the day you put criteria in place as to why you should or shouldnt take a player you certainly try to place a proper value on them. we may disagree on this but i certainly respect where you are coming from.

[Judge Roughneck]

As has been explained - our rucks stocks are not good, more so if Vickery is seen primarily are a forward.

Hence the criteria is the requirement to reinforce the ruck division.

As much as you criticize this trade - I still haven't seen an alternative road to improvement of the ruck stocks

[WA Tiger]

 

FFS, he is in the team, support him or stuff off....pretty simple, close the thread its really stuffing boring.

If you don't like him in the team or the trade stiff poo, its done, its over, he is there....move on!!!!

[Hard Roar Tiger]

Great post WAT 

[tiga]

FFS, he is in the team, support him or stuff off....pretty simple, close the thread its really stuffing boring.

If you don't like him in the team or the trade stiff poo, its done, its over, he is there....move on!!!!

  I agree WAT. Lets at least give the guy a chance before sticking the boot in.

[one-eyed]

From twitter:

Jon Ralph ‏@RalphyHeraldSun

"Mumford for pick 35 damned good value. It's a steal for Giants. Tyson was homesick last year. Smart to trade him before he walked"

Adam White ‏@White_Adam 44s

"@RalphyHeraldSun It's a good deal for the Giants considering Shaun Hampson went to Richmond for 28. Mumford is a premiership ruckman!"

[Coach]

Awww gee

[Rampstar]

Awww gee

Cant argue with the facts unfortunately Carlton robbed us blind on the Hampson trade. He wasnt worth pick 50 let alone 28.

[Stripes]

If all the experts are saying that the draft dries up after pick 30 maybe it wasn't such a horrendous deal afterall 

[wayne]

Yeah Mumford is a much better ruckman, but Mumford on 3x times as much money though and out of contract.

[Rampstar]

If all the experts are saying that the draft dries up after pick 30 maybe it wasn't such a horrendous deal afterall 

Its exactly why we should never have traded 28 out. This is a shallow draft. Clubs have to take 3 picks. Our trading out 28 means we have almost guaranteed ourselves that we will have to draft two dead set duds. If we had 28 we could have had 2 picks out of the 3 inside the 30 and that meant only 1 player outside of 30. Hampson was never worth what we paid.

[Penelope]

beside the likelihood of that pick ending up outside of pick 30, in two years time no one will give a stuff what we gave for him.
The only thing that will matter will be if we should have got him at all.

[WA Tiger]