Author Topic: McBean and non-selection  (Read 10601 times)

Offline Penelope

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #75 on: May 30, 2016, 05:04:14 PM »
i suspect that to those people it does

You'd suspect that but surely you wonder why?
i try not to.
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Nor are your ways my ways,” says the Lord.
 
“For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
So are my ways higher than your ways,
And my thoughts than your thoughts."

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Offline Diocletian

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #76 on: May 30, 2016, 05:26:09 PM »
3 goal non-effort perfectly describes Vickery's game on Saturday Night.....which followed on from his zero goal non-effort that kept him in the side.....

Don't why people want to bring Vickery into it every time McBean's laziness is mentioned. Just because Vickery is lazy it doesn't justify McBean also being lazy.

One's supposedly "lazy" at 21, the other is still lazy at 26....

One has been a benchmark kpf in his league for three years running and has at least three top clubs interested in him, the other is an also-ran, rated by no-one in his league and derided by many in football circles......

One relies on delivery from park footballers on chopped up mud heaps, the other often gets it served up on a platter by the likes of Deledio, Cotchin, Martin on bowling greens against the second or third defender...

One is expected to kick 5 goals, lay half a dozen tackles and run a half marathon for at least 3 weeks running to even be considered for selection, (pretty much confirmed by people within the club), the other can play like absolute crap and take a nap in the forward 50 for a month and still retain his spot...
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Offline YellowandBlackBlood

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #77 on: May 30, 2016, 06:51:06 PM »
3 goal non-effort perfectly describes Vickery's game on Saturday Night.....which followed on from his zero goal non-effort that kept him in the side.....

Don't why people want to bring Vickery into it every time McBean's laziness is mentioned. Just because Vickery is lazy it doesn't justify McBean also being lazy.

One's supposedly "lazy" at 21, the other is still lazy at 26....

One has been a benchmark kpf in his league for three years running and has at least three top clubs interested in him, the other is an also-ran, rated by no-one in his league and derided by many in football circles......

One relies on delivery from park footballers on chopped up mud heaps, the other often gets it served up on a platter by the likes of Deledio, Cotchin, Martin on bowling greens against the second or third defender...

One is expected to kick 5 goals, lay half a dozen tackles and run a half marathon for at least 3 weeks running to even be considered for selection, (pretty much confirmed by people within the club), the other can play like absolute crap and take a nap in the forward 50 for a month and still retain his spot...
But he isn't one of Hardwick's "superstars"…….. :banghead
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Offline Yeahright

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #78 on: May 31, 2016, 09:38:44 AM »
3 goal non-effort perfectly describes Vickery's game on Saturday Night.....which followed on from his zero goal non-effort that kept him in the side.....

Don't why people want to bring Vickery into it every time McBean's laziness is mentioned. Just because Vickery is lazy it doesn't justify McBean also being lazy.

One's supposedly "lazy" at 21, the other is still lazy at 26....

One has been a benchmark kpf in his league for three years running and has at least three top clubs interested in him, the other is an also-ran, rated by no-one in his league and derided by many in football circles......

One relies on delivery from park footballers on chopped up mud heaps, the other often gets it served up on a platter by the likes of Deledio, Cotchin, Martin on bowling greens against the second or third defender...

One is expected to kick 5 goals, lay half a dozen tackles and run a half marathon for at least 3 weeks running to even be considered for selection, (pretty much confirmed by people within the club), the other can play like absolute crap and take a nap in the forward 50 for a month and still retain his spot...

So McBean has been told he's lazy yet he hasn't improved on it but cool, let's bring him in and be stuck with another KPF who's stuffing lazy but never gets dropped for 4 years

Offline Stalin

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #79 on: May 31, 2016, 12:20:07 PM »
3 goal non-effort perfectly describes Vickery's game on Saturday Night.....which followed on from his zero goal non-effort that kept him in the side.....

Don't why people want to bring Vickery into it every time McBean's laziness is mentioned. Just because Vickery is lazy it doesn't justify McBean also being lazy.

One's supposedly "lazy" at 21, the other is still lazy at 26....

One has been a benchmark kpf in his league for three years running and has at least three top clubs interested in him, the other is an also-ran, rated by no-one in his league and derided by many in football circles......

One relies on delivery from park footballers on chopped up mud heaps, the other often gets it served up on a platter by the likes of Deledio, Cotchin, Martin on bowling greens against the second or third defender...

One is expected to kick 5 goals, lay half a dozen tackles and run a half marathon for at least 3 weeks running to even be considered for selection, (pretty much confirmed by people within the club), the other can play like absolute crap and take a nap in the forward 50 for a month and still retain his spot...

So McBean has been told he's lazy yet he hasn't improved on it but cool, let's bring him in and be stuck with another KPF who's stuffing lazy but never gets dropped for 4 years

He will been very non lazy at hawthorn or Sydney

I'm sure they will thank Dimma for teachin McBean hardwork

Meanwhile we will get another year of Tyrone cracking it cause his team mate didn't kick it 70 Meters to him and Chaplin pointing frantically.
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Offline Diocletian

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #80 on: May 31, 2016, 03:08:38 PM »
Hawthorn, Footscray, West Coast & Geelong are all interested in McBean......more than who are interested in Vickery - who's a restricted free agent.....wonder why?  :whistle

3 goal non-effort perfectly describes Vickery's game on Saturday Night.....which followed on from his zero goal non-effort that kept him in the side.....

Don't why people want to bring Vickery into it every time McBean's laziness is mentioned. Just because Vickery is lazy it doesn't justify McBean also being lazy.



One's supposedly "lazy" at 21, the other is still lazy at 26....

One has been a benchmark kpf in his league for three years running and has at least three top clubs interested in him, the other is an also-ran, rated by no-one in his league and derided by many in football circles......

One relies on delivery from park footballers on chopped up mud heaps, the other often gets it served up on a platter by the likes of Deledio, Cotchin, Martin on bowling greens against the second or third defender...

One is expected to kick 5 goals, lay half a dozen tackles and run a half marathon for at least 3 weeks running to even be considered for selection, (pretty much confirmed by people within the club), the other can play like absolute crap and take a nap in the forward 50 for a month and still retain his spot...

So McBean has been told he's lazy yet he hasn't improved on it but cool, let's bring him in and be stuck with another KPF who's stuffing lazy but never gets dropped for 4 years


We already know what Vickery's going to serve up at AFL level and it's highly unlikely to improve. I've heard many differing views on McBean's two senior appearances, yet I haven't heard anyone say he bludged...might've looked lost early in the first match but it wasn't because he was having a smoko .... he certainly didn't hide with Dustin Fletcher on his arse in the second match...players can lift their work rate on the bigger stage with better players around them....and as someone who watched nearly all of his matches in his first three seasons, I've still seen him put more effort into games on more occasions in those three seasons than I've seen from Vickery at any level in eight seasons.


"Much of the social history of the Western world, over the past three decades, has been a history of replacing what worked with what sounded good...."

- Thomas Sowell


FJ is the only one that makes sense.

Offline Yeahright

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #81 on: May 31, 2016, 05:28:12 PM »
My point is, you can argue all day who's lazier but the fact you have to defend someones lazy performance by saying Vickery is just as lazy/lazier pretty much sums up why neither should get a game.

tony_montana

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #82 on: May 31, 2016, 05:36:53 PM »
why not just give him a go? We've seen all there is to see from sideshow, give mcbean a run and lets see if hes got what it takes

Offline Stalin

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #83 on: May 31, 2016, 05:45:33 PM »
why not just give him a go? We've seen all there is to see from sideshow, give mcbean a run and lets see if hes got what it takes


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Offline Diocletian

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #84 on: May 31, 2016, 05:51:18 PM »
My point is, you can argue all day who's lazier but the fact you have to defend someones lazy performance by saying Vickery is just as lazy/lazier pretty much sums up why neither should get a game.

I personally think the laziness has been massively exaggerated, though I haven't been able to watch any VFL so far this year, particularly for a KPF in a bottom 4 side, whose midfield is pathetic and the ball is never in his half for long periods -yet still over three years no forward in the VFL has kicked more goals than him. I've seen enough of him to tell me he has what it takes to play AFL and I think he'll be a far better player than Vickery & Griffiths (not hard I know) in fact I think he already is better than Vickery.... and considering McBean is the only other KPF currently available for senior selection who else replaces Vickery? Or should we continue to just reward Vickery by default? Could play Lennon I guess, but he's still out with concussion and Half-Step's in love with the three-tall set-up anyway.
"Much of the social history of the Western world, over the past three decades, has been a history of replacing what worked with what sounded good...."

- Thomas Sowell


FJ is the only one that makes sense.

Offline Penelope

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #85 on: May 31, 2016, 06:02:52 PM »
cept we currently are mainly using a two tall forward setup.

The distinct impression I get is that some of you are prepared to overlook bad traits as long as the player in question has natural talent.

Yet funnily enough, vickery has talent but lets himself down with work rate and intensity, which means he never gets the best of himself so the talent is wasted.

“For My thoughts are not your thoughts,
Nor are your ways my ways,” says the Lord.
 
“For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
So are my ways higher than your ways,
And my thoughts than your thoughts."

Yahweh? or the great Clawski?

yaw rehto eht dellorcs ti fi daer ot reisae eb dluow tI

tony_montana

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #86 on: May 31, 2016, 06:12:39 PM »
No its not that - we all know Ty has a lot of natural talent

Some people simply feel there are clear double standards going on which is unfair, its simple as that.

Offline Penelope

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #87 on: May 31, 2016, 06:32:53 PM »
so what message does it send if you're telling a player he needs to improve his workrate and then you reward him with a senior selection despite not improving on that?

on one hand people spew on vickery because he is lazy and plays without intensity, yet scream blue murder because he isnt being replaced with a bloke, who from many accounts this season, has exactly the same issue.

we just end up with the same poo in a different bucket.



“For My thoughts are not your thoughts,
Nor are your ways my ways,” says the Lord.
 
“For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
So are my ways higher than your ways,
And my thoughts than your thoughts."

Yahweh? or the great Clawski?

yaw rehto eht dellorcs ti fi daer ot reisae eb dluow tI

Offline YellowandBlackBlood

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #88 on: May 31, 2016, 06:36:45 PM »
so what message does it send if you're telling a player he needs to improve his workrate and then you reward him with a senior selection despite not improving on that?

on one hand people spew on vickery because he is lazy and plays without intensity, yet scream blue murder because he isnt being replaced with a bloke, who from many accounts this season, has exactly the same issue.

we just end up with the same poo in a different bucket.
Difficult situation as we reward Tyrone too. Yet he is surrounded by better players.
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Offline Diocletian

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Re: McBean and non-selection
« Reply #89 on: May 31, 2016, 06:40:15 PM »
cept we currently are mainly using a two tall forward setup.





Set-up was he wrong term.I meant playing three tall forwards in the side on top of the specialist ruck, though we usually have a three tall forward line when they're all on the ground at once with Hamspud.

Quote
The distinct impression I get is that some of you are prepared to overlook bad traits as long as the player in question has natural talent.

Yet funnily enough, vickery has talent but lets himself down with work rate and intensity, which means he never gets the best of himself so the talent is wasted.

As I said, I think McBean's bad traits are overstated. We should at least be having a look at him.

I don't think Vickery is a particularly talented or natural forward, he's real talent in my eyes is on -ball and that's when he plays his best football (see the Sydney match last year) - great in traffic for his size and demonstrates an agilty we rarely see from him up forward, like a classic see ball get ball mid who plays better when doesn't have to think or worry about his positioning or almost like Stynes minus the ruck work....unfortunately he's pee poor ruckman and it's probably not feasible to play him purely as a 200cm midfielder or even on the wing like Richo as lacks the freakish aerobic capacity that Richo had.

The only other way would to be play him in the ruck, concede the hit outs and try and shark the opposition hit outs....it's often said it's easier to rove when you know your either going to win all the hit -outs or lose them all, it's when it's 50-50 that's it's hardest.....at the very least, it would give us more agilty and "pace" around the ground with Vickery, Griffiths, Riewoldt & McBean than Vickery, Griffiths, Riewoldt & Hamspud.
"Much of the social history of the Western world, over the past three decades, has been a history of replacing what worked with what sounded good...."

- Thomas Sowell


FJ is the only one that makes sense.