Author Topic: Dustin Martin [merged]  (Read 1152739 times)

Offline WA Tiger

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2760 on: September 21, 2013, 10:08:13 AM »
Just get it done Tiges!!!!!
DIMMA - You will be held ACCOUNTABLE...

“We are really excited about what we have brought in. We have got great depth of players that can take us where we need to go. We are just putting some cream on the top at the moment,” he said.

"Rucks:
Shaun Hampson is the No.1 man"

Rampstar

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2761 on: September 21, 2013, 10:08:29 AM »
continuing the failed policies that existed for 30 years is simply wrong. the club wont go down the same road again. in terms of drawing a line in the sand they have decided to do it here and with good reason. Just think of this, if they gave martin the 650k per year his manager wanted what would happen in 2 years when he is out of contract again. Would you be happy for his manager to up the price to 800k a  year? And would you be happy if it cost us a player like Brandon Ellis or Nick Vlastuin? Would you be happy for our club to have no room to move in bringing new players to the club. For example this year we are looking at bringing in players like Taylor Adams and Billy Longer, I can almost guarantee that giving Martin and Conca what they wanted would mean there would be absolutely no chance of getting either. Now there is some chance.

The days of the players and the coteries running the club are over and rightly so. The players and the coteries have rooted our club for 30 years. Enough is Enough.

Offline WA Tiger

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2762 on: September 21, 2013, 10:12:23 AM »
continuing the failed policies that existed for 30 years is simply wrong. the club wont go down the same road again. in terms of drawing a line in the sand they have decided to do it here and with good reason. Just think of this, if they gave martin the 650k per year his manager wanted what would happen in 2 years when he is out of contract again. Would you be happy for his manager to up the price to 800k a  year? And would you be happy if it cost us a player like Brandon Ellis or Nick Vlastuin? Would you be happy for our club to have no room to move in bringing new players to the club. For example this year we are looking at bringing in players like Taylor Adams and Billy Longer, I can almost guarantee that giving Martin and Conca what they wanted would mean there would be absolutely no chance of getting either. Now there is some chance.

The days of the players and the coteries running the club are over and rightly so. The players and the coteries have rooted our club for 30 years. Enough is Enough.

Yep agree but it should of been done years ago as I said, not now, why not pay him the money, then draw the line in the sand for future deals?
DIMMA - You will be held ACCOUNTABLE...

“We are really excited about what we have brought in. We have got great depth of players that can take us where we need to go. We are just putting some cream on the top at the moment,” he said.

"Rucks:
Shaun Hampson is the No.1 man"

Dougeytherichmondfan

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2763 on: September 21, 2013, 10:14:29 AM »
The article said Conca signed before his manager was in town, don't know what that means?
Positives from this whole saga, Richmond come out looking like a genuine organisation, which in turn attracts other players. They've set their own standard, and any player who doesn't want to be a part of it is "welcome" to go and search elsewhere. What's glaringly obvious is that no one wants to leave. I'm all for a player trying to get just payments, after-all we deserve what we're worth. Carr obviously put Martin in some deluded mindset that he was work 700k and surprisingly, Martin (who isn't the most impressionable bloke going around......oh wait) was taken along for the ride.

My concern at this point is, that they almost HAVE to pay unders for him now, seeing as every other player that has signed up this year has been offered unders (with the exception of Cotchin I believe). Not much for team comradery if one bloke is getting 650 whilst everyone else is sitting well below that and offering just as much on field.

Rampstar

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2764 on: September 21, 2013, 10:18:01 AM »
players like cotchin, riewoldt, deledio all took unders to stay. conca took unders to stay. ellis probably could have gotten more if he wanted. lots of players have taken unders so they can stay together and let the club have an opportunity to bring in quality players from other clubs to give us a chance for a flag in the next 2 or 3 years. martin is not the first nor is it a precedent, the change has been happening for a while.

Offline Penelope

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2765 on: September 21, 2013, 10:19:56 AM »
Well for how many years have we overpaid players to keep them? Bloody every year, every year we have overpaid crap players, absolute crap players, now we have a star, possibly a Brownlow medalist and we want to draw a line in the sand now.... Honestly. Perhaps if the line was drawn with players like Nathan Brown, Darren Gasper, Sanchez and the like there would be a president to follow. To start now with this player is ludicrous, pay him the extra $100,000 and be done with it.

Youve lost the plot WA  :gotigers
Can you lose something you never had?

When the Delideo contract was dragging out, he was bagged furiously, and it was the end of the world if he left, yet he he ended up signing a long term contract for less than he could have got on the open market.

Now we have a player, who is extremely high maintenance, at the insistence of his knob head manager, asking for well over his market value, and it is the club who is in the wrong. Once again though, it is the end of the world if he leaves.
And what is the justification for caving in to these petulant, unreasonable demands and paying over the odds? the fact that we have done such stupidity in the past?

The next stage of this will be name calling of those that dare to point out the silliness of it.

“For My thoughts are not your thoughts,
Nor are your ways my ways,” says the Lord.
 
“For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
So are my ways higher than your ways,
And my thoughts than your thoughts."

Yahweh? or the great Clawski?

yaw rehto eht dellorcs ti fi daer ot reisae eb dluow tI

Offline Chuck17

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2766 on: September 21, 2013, 10:30:33 AM »
continuing the failed policies that existed for 30 years is simply wrong. the club wont go down the same road again. in terms of drawing a line in the sand they have decided to do it here and with good reason. Just think of this, if they gave martin the 650k per year his manager wanted what would happen in 2 years when he is out of contract again. Would you be happy for his manager to up the price to 800k a  year? And would you be happy if it cost us a player like Brandon Ellis or Nick Vlastuin? Would you be happy for our club to have no room to move in bringing new players to the club. For example this year we are looking at bringing in players like Taylor Adams and Billy Longer, I can almost guarantee that giving Martin and Conca what they wanted would mean there would be absolutely no chance of getting either. Now there is some chance.

The days of the players and the coteries running the club are over and rightly so. The players and the coteries have rooted our club for 30 years. Enough is Enough.

Yep agree but it should of been done years ago as I said, not now, why not pay him the money, then draw the line in the sand for future deals?

Yes very credible action, sure to create no issues down the track

Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2767 on: September 21, 2013, 10:34:09 AM »
The article said Conca signed before his manager was in town, don't know what that means?

No it doens't.

It says "If only he had the strength he demonstrates on the MCG and took a stand on his own as Reece Conca did this week and put pen to paper without waiting for his manager to get to town". Which means why couldn't Dusty do what Reece Conca did (take less money to stay) and sign a contract while his manager (Carr) was interstate

players like cotchin, riewoldt, deledio all took unders to stay. conca took unders to stay. ellis probably could have gotten more if he wanted. lots of players have taken unders so they can stay together and let the club have an opportunity to bring in quality players from other clubs to give us a chance for a flag in the next 2 or 3 years. martin is not the first nor is it a precedent, the change has been happening for a while.

I've said this before Ramps I dont' believe Cotchin took unders at all. The others have but from what I heard Cotchin offer was right on market value. He is now our higest paid player (rightly) but I dont' believe he took unders

But outside of that I agree 100% with your comments


Especially this:

continuing the failed policies that existed for 30 years is simply wrong. the club wont go down the same road again. in terms of drawing a line in the sand they have decided to do it here and with good reason. Just think of this, if they gave martin the 650k per year his manager wanted what would happen in 2 years when he is out of contract again. Would you be happy for his manager to up the price to 800k a  year? And would you be happy if it cost us a player like Brandon Ellis or Nick Vlastuin? Would you be happy for our club to have no room to move in bringing new players to the club. For example this year we are looking at bringing in players like Taylor Adams and Billy Longer, I can almost guarantee that giving Martin and Conca what they wanted would mean there would be absolutely no chance of getting either. Now there is some chance.

The days of the players and the coteries running the club are over and rightly so. The players and the coteries have rooted our club for 30 years. Enough is Enough.

Which is one of the best posts I've read in a very very long time  :clapping :clapping

And BTW I hope your not having a whack at all coterie members  ;) ;D
"Oh yes I am a dreamer, I still see us flying high!"

from the song "Don't Walk Away" by Pat Benatar 1988 (Wide Awake In Dreamland)

Online Hard Roar Tiger

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2768 on: September 21, 2013, 10:43:17 AM »
The article by Caro made me proud to be a Tiger, what a glowing endorsement of our club to any young players aspiring to play AFL.
Carrs technique is good old fashioned haggling - the lowest tier of negotiating - not unusual to see this type of negotiating being delayed over a few thousand bucks. Tells you something about the mentality of the individual. Ever been to a night market in Sth East Asia?
Frighteningly it still works in some cases but no longer at Tigerland  :thumbsup
Tell you what, they'd see WAT coming from a mile away  :lol
“I find it nearly impossible to make those judgments, but he is certainly up there with the really important ones, he is certainly up there with the Francis Bourkes and the Royce Harts and the Kevin Bartlett and the Kevin Sheedys, there is no doubt about that,” Balme said.

Offline one-eyed

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2769 on: September 21, 2013, 10:46:32 AM »
WANTAWAY Tiger Dustin Martin is likely to return to Richmond with his tale between his legs, with only the embattled Brisbane Lions offering an escape route from Punt Rd.

Lions football manager Robb Kerr said yesterday: “We will certainly talk to him.”

But for a club with no coach, a player exodus looming and a warring board summoned to an AFL meditation hearing, Martin would seem highly unlikely to sign at the Gabba.

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/gws-giants-decide-not-to-pursue-unsigned-richmond-star-dustin-martin/story-fnfll94y-1226723527290#mm-breached

Offline one-eyed

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2770 on: September 21, 2013, 10:48:43 AM »
Martin bluff is straight out of the Dyer manual

    Tony Hardy
    Herald Sun
    September 21, 2013


YOU'D think Dustin Martin had "I hate Richmond" tattooed in Latin on his neck. That he's burned down Punt Road using his jumper for kindling. He's behaving in a most un-Tigerish sort of way, you hear, the sort of ungrateful and selfish standoff that'd have Jack "Captain Blood" Dyer, turning in his grave, wanting to break Dusty's collarbone and knock some sense into him.

Yes, he seems a little mercenary at the moment, but if you look a little deeper, it would appear that Dusty's been studying the history of Tigerland. He's only doing what the greatest Tiger of them all did. And Jack Dyer so loved at Tigerland there's a statue of him out the front of Punt Road.

It's the art of the bluff and Jack was way ahead of both Dusty and Richmond.

In 1930, Jack was a prodigiously talented 17-year-old. He was playing in the local leagues, matches so tough that violence broke out between the players, between the spectators and between the players and the spectators who often crossed the white line and threw a few if they didn't like what they saw.

It was the Great Depression and Jack was keen to make some money playing in the VFL. But he was sick of being ignored by the administrators at Punt Road. So he threatened to sign up with Collingwood, the enemy who lived down the hill off Hoddle St. He took the club on before he had even played a game of senior football. He gambled his football career, potentially his only chance to earn money to feed his family, most of whom were unemployed.

The bluff worked. Richmond signed him up.

Jack played a couple of games for the Tiges, but was relegated to the seconds where the young champion couldn't get a kick. Why? The seconds players protected each other, and their wage, and ignored Jack. During the games, they wouldn't kick it to him. Jack was running about not touching the footy and so unable to impress seniors coach Checker Hughes. So what did he do?

Jack walked away. It was 1931. This wasn't the small Depression or the medium-sized Depression. It was The Great Depression. Jack abandoned a job where all he had to do was play football. Yet call it arrogance, lucky stupidity or genius, the bluff worked. Certain Richmond seconds players were sacked and Jack was coaxed back.

Ten years later, before the 1940 season, Jack's father Ben failed in a bid to be elected to the Richmond Committee. So our hero, by then the game's most fearsome, most loved, most hated, most famous footballer, quit Tigerland. On March 1, 1940, it was announced that Jack "Captain Blood" Dyer, was seeking a clearance and had received an offer to play for Victorian Football Association side Yarraville. When training for the new season began on March 19, six weeks before the game against Footscray, there was no sight of Jack.

The supporters were starting to believe he was gone forever when finally, on April 2, three weeks before the start of the football year, Jack appeared at training. He was back. The bluff was over.

"I didn't want to leave," Jack recalled years later. "But I was bitter about the way things had been handled (with his father, Ben). I knew I was playing well and I figured I'd give them a bit of hurt for a while."

If Dusty Martin is a student of Tigerland, then could he simply be repeating the actions of the club hero? After all the fuss, will he soon sign to remain at Richmond? And, through his manager, release a modern-day version of Jack's statement, a tweet that says: "Didn't want to go, dudes. But jacked about the way it was handled. I no I'm a gun. Figured I'd give'm max pain. All good. Dusty #jackdyerthesecond."

The Dusty Martin contract saga is just that, a drawn-out, teasing manipulation by both parties of each other's intentions. Following the cruel fall over the cliff face that was Richmond's loss in the Elimination Final, Richmond people are angry. They need to blame someone for the horror of that Sunday afternoon, made worse as it came at the end of the most glorious season for a decade and the opposition was Carlton. The Tiger Army are hurting but the rejection of Dusty Martin is not only misguided, it even stinks of hypocrisy. Who among us hasn't threatened to walk out on their employer unless they're given a pay rise? And who among us can claim that this old bluff actually works?

It only works for the greats. And Dusty could well be one of them.

Tony Hardy is a Melbourne writer and author of Finding Jack Dyer

http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/martin-bluff-is-straight-out-of-the-dyer-manual/story-e6frfkp9-1226723936300

Offline Yeahright

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2771 on: September 21, 2013, 11:11:45 AM »
continuing the failed policies that existed for 30 years is simply wrong. the club wont go down the same road again. in terms of drawing a line in the sand they have decided to do it here and with good reason. Just think of this, if they gave martin the 650k per year his manager wanted what would happen in 2 years when he is out of contract again. Would you be happy for his manager to up the price to 800k a  year? And would you be happy if it cost us a player like Brandon Ellis or Nick Vlastuin? Would you be happy for our club to have no room to move in bringing new players to the club. For example this year we are looking at bringing in players like Taylor Adams and Billy Longer, I can almost guarantee that giving Martin and Conca what they wanted would mean there would be absolutely no chance of getting either. Now there is some chance.

The days of the players and the coteries running the club are over and rightly so. The players and the coteries have rooted our club for 30 years. Enough is Enough.

Yep agree but it should of been done years ago as I said, not now, why not pay him the money, then draw the line in the sand for future deals?


Would truly screw us over in the long run if we paid him the extra. I'm glad you don't work for RFC
« Last Edit: September 21, 2013, 04:25:04 PM by one-eyed »

Rampstar

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2772 on: September 21, 2013, 12:35:12 PM »
The article said Conca signed before his manager was in town, don't know what that means?

No it doens't.

It says "If only he had the strength he demonstrates on the MCG and took a stand on his own as Reece Conca did this week and put pen to paper without waiting for his manager to get to town". Which means why couldn't Dusty do what Reece Conca did (take less money to stay) and sign a contract while his manager (Carr) was interstate

players like cotchin, riewoldt, deledio all took unders to stay. conca took unders to stay. ellis probably could have gotten more if he wanted. lots of players have taken unders so they can stay together and let the club have an opportunity to bring in quality players from other clubs to give us a chance for a flag in the next 2 or 3 years. martin is not the first nor is it a precedent, the change has been happening for a while.

I've said this before Ramps I dont' believe Cotchin took unders at all. The others have but from what I heard Cotchin offer was right on market value. He is now our higest paid player (rightly) but I dont' believe he took unders

But outside of that I agree 100% with your comments


Especially this:

continuing the failed policies that existed for 30 years is simply wrong. the club wont go down the same road again. in terms of drawing a line in the sand they have decided to do it here and with good reason. Just think of this, if they gave martin the 650k per year his manager wanted what would happen in 2 years when he is out of contract again. Would you be happy for his manager to up the price to 800k a  year? And would you be happy if it cost us a player like Brandon Ellis or Nick Vlastuin? Would you be happy for our club to have no room to move in bringing new players to the club. For example this year we are looking at bringing in players like Taylor Adams and Billy Longer, I can almost guarantee that giving Martin and Conca what they wanted would mean there would be absolutely no chance of getting either. Now there is some chance.

The days of the players and the coteries running the club are over and rightly so. The players and the coteries have rooted our club for 30 years. Enough is Enough.

Which is one of the best posts I've read in a very very long time  :clapping :clapping

And BTW I hope your not having a whack at all coterie members  ;) ;D

Alot of coterie members have been great supporters of the club but a small vocal minority of coterie people have used contacts in the press and various people to agigate for change in coaches and administration regularly and IMHO its never been to our benefit. As long as Brendon and the new president can maintain the status quo where the coteries have less of a say the better. So dont take my post personally, it was never intended to be a total criticism of all in the coteries, just some who have overrated opinions of themselves who believe that because they put in a decent amount of money they have a god given right to execute whatever change they feel is popular at the time.  :cheers

Offline Smokey

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2773 on: September 21, 2013, 01:11:11 PM »
continuing the failed policies that existed for 30 years is simply wrong. the club wont go down the same road again. in terms of drawing a line in the sand they have decided to do it here and with good reason. Just think of this, if they gave martin the 650k per year his manager wanted what would happen in 2 years when he is out of contract again. Would you be happy for his manager to up the price to 800k a  year? And would you be happy if it cost us a player like Brandon Ellis or Nick Vlastuin? Would you be happy for our club to have no room to move in bringing new players to the club. For example this year we are looking at bringing in players like Taylor Adams and Billy Longer, I can almost guarantee that giving Martin and Conca what they wanted would mean there would be absolutely no chance of getting either. Now there is some chance.

The days of the players and the coteries running the club are over and rightly so. The players and the coteries have rooted our club for 30 years. Enough is Enough.

Yep agree but it should of been done years ago as I said, not now, why not pay him the money, then draw the line in the sand for future deals?

 :lol

WAT, seriously, that is probably the worst attempt at justification of a poor policy that I have ever read.

Offline Chuck17

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Re: Dustin Martin [merged]
« Reply #2774 on: September 21, 2013, 01:12:55 PM »
He should get a job with the Labor party, sign him up '65