Sack Hardwick [merged]

[tony_montana]

I remember reading the same sort of thing from you when we were talking about sacking TW. Do you remember that Stripes? You backed him and blamed everyone but him... He'd got sacked and rightly so.
Now you have just blamed, Dimma's lack of help (which is his fault IMO, I'm sure he gets a say on who his employees are. He is very PIGHEADED and thinks he doesn't need help. That is as obvious as the nose on your face)
You blamed the game plan- which is 100% Dimma's fault.
You blamed the change in the umpiring, which is just ridiculas
You blamed the list which unfortunately is Dimma's responsibility while he is coach of the club.
At the end of the day what does he bring?
He has shown at match committee he has favourites.
He has refused to play (and draft) young kids this year.
His game style is 5 years too late.
He has NO PLAN B
Nothing against you Stripes but seriously why would we keep him other than for the money thing?

so what I'm getting is the problem is the same with Hardwick as it was with Wallace? Doesn't that mean there is something wrong somewhere deeper in the club? Instead of going after the easy target "The Coach" shouldn't we be demanding "The Club" does more to insure we have the right footballers?

I dont know where you got that from but we all know thats not what it is. Hardwick has had a support network and footy department TW and every preceding RFC coach did not - not even close. When TW was coach Greg Miller was the footy department boss AND recruiting FFS we only had our quota of assistant line coaches no development coaches...

To the clubs credit they finally got it right and realised we needed to beef up the footy depart across the board which they have done significantly the past 5 years. Now they need to refine it and bring in better people to replace current employees including the coach whose direction has to be questioned.

If they dont want to replace the coach bc of contractual obligations then replace Hartley and FJ and bring in some more assistant/development coaches.

[Chuck17]

You're loopy dude. So to be A-grade it is a requirement to kick x amount of goals? Might as well fill the AA team with forwards ey

I thought this was an open forum but if you want to start disparaging remarks it does make it harder to have an intelligent debate...

LMAO you have seen nothing yet if you are taking offense at that, run away and go get your hard hat sonny

[Yeahright]

You're loopy dude. So to be A-grade it is a requirement to kick x amount of goals? Might as well fill the AA team with forwards ey

I thought this was an open forum but if you want to start disparaging remarks it does make it harder to have an intelligent debate...

Rance does his job and that is it - an A-grader does his job and more (is that simple enough for you to understand)

Loopy was tongue in cheek  hence the dude after it. It's a bit harsh to expect Rance to kick goals off his own boot though is it not? Shouldn't his ability as a key defender to still be probably our best rebounding defender be a credit to him and be an example of how he goes beyond just his role?

[unplugged]

Sacking Hardwick would be a huge mistake imo.

Stripes.  Be interested to know why you think it would be a huge mistake?  What is the downside? 

The only downside I can see is the loss of $$$ from paying out his contract but I reckon that would be mitigated by the loss of $$$ keeping him would have on attendances, membership and sponsorship.

[eliminator]

There is a multitude of problems at this club including but not limited to:

1. The List;
2. The poor performance of the assistant coaches except for Choco;
3. Poor drafting-eg not getting a quality small forward
4. Culture- eg of underperforming and downhill skiers
5. Attitude- eg thinking in a better position than are;
6. The game plan and the lack of an alternative.

Whilst is clear that the coach must bear some responsibility for problems it is not entirely the coach's fault. Others in this club need to be held accountable eg football department as a whole. Removing just the coach does not fix the problems. If you are going to have change it needs to be far reaching.

I wasn't saying it was Dimma's fault entirely. But these points you bring up are the coaches responsibility.

The List- is Dimma's responsibility while he is in charge. If he thought throughout his 5 years that FJ and his team were no good he should do whatever it takes to replace them. Just like if a player was no good, it's Dimma's responsibility to replace them.

The poor performance of the assistant coaches- once again I don't think you can blame anyone else for who are the assistant coaches other than Dimma. Let's be honest most of them are 'no names'
I'm afraid IMO Dimma like to do things Dimma's way and having STRONG outspoken people around him I don't think really suits Dimma. Even Choco seems to have a lesser roll this year.

Poor drafting- see item 1. He needs to get people into the job that can deliver because it impacts on him. FJ has had long enough to get better at what he does.. In any other industry he would have been shown the door a long time ago. Getting our first pick right mostly is not enough. IMO even the size of the players drafted for their position with our first pick doesn't relay what the industry is doing. To many undersized midfielders.

Culture- culture IMO is winning. You win games and the culture takes care of itself. Dimma's responsibility.

Attitude- don't think anyone can argue that attitude is the coaching departments responsibility.

The game plan and lack of alternative- see above.

So I'm not really sure what part of our problem hasn't got to do with Dimma and his team that he has created. The only part the CLUB can be at fault of doing is giving Dimma an extension when they did. Nobody was going to poach him, why not leave it until closer to the end of his current contract?
Now as a CLUB we have to either pay him out and look like idiots or keep him there for another two years and undo all the good work they had done previously.

a lot of the things you have raised in my humble opinion are very valid but culture stems from the top. It is ultimately the entire club's responsibility. For example it is the club that ultimately determines who coaches the club and what expectations they have of the coach. Furthermore the appointment of staff in the football department whilst Dimma has a say is ultimately a decision of the club. The club as a whole needs to take responsibility for the debacle we are in. If you get rid of the coach you need to get rid of the underperforming players and staff such as recruiters and assistant coaches. Far sweeping change is required.

[Diocletian]

Sacking Hardwick would be a huge mistake imo.

Stripes.  Be interested to know why you think it would be a huge mistake?  What is the downside? 

The only downside I can see is the loss of $$$ from paying out his contract but I reckon that would be mitigated by the loss of $$$ keeping him would have on attendances, membership and sponsorship.

Eggs Zachary

[Judge Roughneck]

if gary ablett was at richmond and did his shoulder...

would dimma tell to keep playing or get the op?

dont forget the crowds...

[Hard Roar Tiger]

Keeping Hardwick or dumping him is a performance issue, not $. It's Richmond. A new coach brings more $ than a poorly performing contracted one. That's the easy bit.
His performance as a coach and particularly his senior selections have been disgraceful. The players talk standards in the media  - it's like Rolf Harris talking stranger danger. Hardwick in 1 year has almost undone the previous 4.
It's going to be a massive call but he is actually making it easier on the powers that be by continually leading with his chin

[Tiger-Harted]

LMAO you have seen nothing yet if you are taking offense at that, run away and go get your hard hat sonny

I didn't take offence just the fact that the first words out of his mouth is an insult proves a lack of intellect and as an adult I expect to have conversations here with people of like reason - I would expect that sought of thing from some who lacks maturity. Grown men don't need to be derogatory or demeaning to get their point across...

[Tiger-Harted]

Loopy was tongue in cheek  hence the dude after it. It's a bit harsh to expect Rance to kick goals off his own boot though is it not? Shouldn't his ability as a key defender to still be probably our best rebounding defender be a credit to him and be an example of how he goes beyond just his role?

I hear you - Rance is just about the best part of the team at the moment - I agree with that but we are in desperate need of players that break lines and take on the game...

Surely you must me angry when you watch the players flat footed when we have possession and the half-hearted chases when the opposition does
 

[Tiger-Harted]

I dont know where you got that from but we all know thats not what it is. Hardwick has had a support network and footy department TW and every preceding RFC coach did not - not even close. When TW was coach Greg Miller was the footy department boss AND recruiting FFS we only had our quota of assistant line coaches no development coaches...

To the clubs credit they finally got it right and realised we needed to beef up the footy depart across the board which they have done significantly the past 5 years. Now they need to refine it and bring in better people to replace current employees including the coach whose direction has to be questioned.

If they dont want to replace the coach bc of contractual obligations then replace Hartley and FJ and bring in some more assistant/development coaches.

OK firstly football as a game has changed dramatically over the last decade and we have only just come out of the finacial hole we built for ourselves after the revenge buying we did with Collingwood (30 years to pay back the debt) - we had restraints Barlett had even less and the footballers supplied to him shouldn't have got a game with the seconds...

I should point out that Greg Miller does not rate highly in human beings I have known so I shouldn't get involved in a conversation about him...

Wallace came in and at first he looked like he too was building something but then it all turned to garbage (seems to be a pattern)

let's pretend for a minute you are right  what would it achieve? Who would you replace Hardwick with? Even a new coach couldn't win a premiership with the cattle we have (let's face it they are just not good enough) We need some class players to make this list work...

I don't disagree with you about Jackson and Hartley (and there are a numbers of others that sould also be shown the door - before Hardwick)

[Judge Roughneck]

what would it achieve?

a lot

[Yeahright]

LMAO you have seen nothing yet if you are taking offense at that, run away and go get your hard hat sonny

I didn't take offence just the fact that the first words out of his mouth is an insult proves a lack of intellect and as an adult I expect to have conversations here with people of like reason - I would expect that sought of thing from some who lacks maturity. Grown men don't need to be derogatory or demeaning to get their point across...

I didn't expect anyone on this forum to even take loopy as an insult .

I'm just still baffled at you rating Jackson as well as Cotchin etc.

[Stripes]

Sorry I missed all this discussion but I'm here now so I thought i would answer a few of your questions. As I've said earlier, I know my opinion isn't a popular one around here but I feel there are far too many supporters out there who like to blame the head coach for ever problem we ever have - that is outright BS.


On Wallace
I did support Wallace for longer than many here but many death rode him from almost the get-go too. He lost me in his last year when he began to try and save his career and promote himself as a list analyst. Wallace was a good coach but he just wasn't the right coach for us at that time. Wallace was very media savvy and his spin allowed us a few years to rebuild without the immediate negative media scrutiny we had faced with other coaches. He was a good tactician and motivator. The problem was though, he was not a developer of youth and left others to educate our draftees while he worked on strategies.

As a result he barely spoke to some of our young players personally at all. With the sheer amount of young players and investment we had put into these high draft picks, it was a horrible failure by Wallace not to teach them how to play. Instead he relied upon his 'age bracket' theory that when the majority of our lust reached a certain age we would be contenders. What he failed to realize is that to make it to that golden age/experience level you have to have shown enough talent to still be on that list. Most of our high draftees never reached their potential.

The other major difference was that Wallace had little to no financial, assistant or board level support. We had the right idea as a club but then we didn't invest in recruitment or development. Wallace had no chance unless he took this all on himself which he didn't and is probably unrealistic to suggest he could do so regardless.

[Stripes]

There is a multitude of problems at this club including but not limited to:

1. The List;
2. The poor performance of the assistant coaches except for Choco;
3. Poor drafting-eg not getting a quality small forward
4. Culture- eg of underperforming and downhill skiers
5. Attitude- eg thinking in a better position than are;
6. The game plan and the lack of an alternative.

Whilst is clear that the coach must bear some responsibility for problems it is not entirely the coach's fault. Others in this club need to be held accountable eg football department as a whole. Removing just the coach does not fix the problems. If you are going to have change it needs to be far reaching.