Author Topic: Essendon face AFL probe/Players found Guilty by CAS  (Read 662418 times)

Offline Judge Roughneck

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #690 on: June 25, 2013, 08:16:31 PM »
I just watched the On The Couch replay of Jobe Watson's interview.  It appeared to me that it was a very carefully scripted set of questions and answers.  Neither Healy, nor Milhouse, nor Roos showed any shock about Jobe's admission.  There were no follow up questions nor any probing.  Watson's answers seemed to quite contrived and carefully phrased in legalese.

I can't work out why Jobe and his legal advisers determined that it would be beneficial to fess up last night, but if anyone is claiming that it was an off-th-cuff set of questions and answers, then I've got some shares in a bridge that I'd like to sell them.



Online WilliamPowell

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #691 on: June 25, 2013, 08:36:21 PM »

Whatever happens it was a very foolish thing for Jobe to say on live TV

I'm not sure if it matters WP.  I reckon by Jobe's comments last night that he has likely been just as honest and forthright in his interview with ASADA and would have told them the exact same thing, so to publicly say it now will have no further impact on what is already going to happen.  Just mho.

By foolish I mean the stir/firestorm it was always going to create.

The headlines, the talkback, Father Tim giving his views (he should SU IMO), the media camped outside Jobe's front door waiting for him to appear and then his "1 minute comment" this arvo

No need for it, pretty sure it wasn't what the EFC wanted
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Offline Yeahright

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #692 on: June 25, 2013, 08:39:34 PM »
You give some really good points WP.

I'm just playing devils advocate here on the players behalf.

Absolutely agree that Hird has to go. The media won't like it and there will be plenty of debate over the "golden boy". But as he's already stated in the original club press conference was that he takes full responsibility for what's happened. More the likely Hirds mates in the media will conveniently forget all about what he said.
The club will have to be heavily punished too. 

In light of the arguements, common sense & evidence you've so expertly put forward, there are still a few questions left unanswered;
Did any player at the club inform their parents or player managers about the program?
Did altleast one parent or player manager know about this?
If they did, did they approach the club for clarification on what was given to their kids/clients?

As you've already stated its mindboggling if atleast one parent or manager or the players association didnt know about this. And if they didn't, why didnt they know? Was it so top secret the club informed the players not to talk about it to anyone?


That said I still think the players will fight tooth and nail to clear their names.

Just a question for you. If all your points were true i.e. players took illegal substances but they prove they were told they were legal by the club, do you still ban players from playing or at a minimum don't let them play for points? Or do you sack the staff involved but let the players continue to play?
No idea. But I'd expect the club to pay dearly. Hird to get the arse don't see him getting out of this mess and if he does it would be an absolute joke.
As a player I would be fighting to clear my name and I'd expect the PA to fight with me to do it.
If I was banned I'd be suing the club also.

Fair enough I just have a strong opinion that if they took those drugs knowing they were illegal or not they shouldn't play or at least for prem points. It's just unfair.

Offline Yeahright

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #693 on: June 25, 2013, 08:41:49 PM »
whats this about an abandoned shed? i must have missed that part.

It wasn't an abandoned shed al,

But it has been reported and confirmed that the players went off site to have the injections and they were not administered by the Club doctor or administered with a club doctor present. Which is a clear breach of the WADA/ASADA codes

 :lol Yeah I got a bit carried away with the abandoned shed bit, although it wouldn't surprise me.

Offline Tigeritis™©®

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #694 on: June 25, 2013, 08:44:05 PM »
I just watched the On The Couch replay of Jobe Watson's interview.  It appeared to me that it was a very carefully scripted set of questions and answers.  Neither Healy, nor Milhouse, nor Roos showed any shock about Jobe's admission.  There were no follow up questions nor any probing.  Watson's answers seemed to quite contrived and carefully phrased in legalese.

I can't work out why Jobe and his legal advisers determined that it would be beneficial to fess up last night, but if anyone is claiming that it was an off-th-cuff set of questions and answers, then I've got some shares in a bridge that I'd like to sell them.

Just watched it too Muscles and your summary is spot on. This is supposed to be a pretty big admission to make and a journo like Milhouse lol would normally have been salivating over breaking a 'story' like that.
To me the breaking part of that story is that the Watson's are flagging and explaining the legal stance that the Bombers are going to take once they are officially found to have taken a non-legal substance. Non legal by the way means illegal Ess you stuffing cheats. The other thing that should have had Sheahan in convulsions was when Watson fingered the club doctor. That definitely required more questioning, as he has been portrayed as being blindsided by the whole affair, but last night Watson said he took the injections based on his advice.

I think the AFL has got enough to go on now and should start making it's move on the Bombers. The Commission will have already decided on the punishment, it will look much better on our code if we are proactive about this!
Spot on guys. I noticed this too. As I've already stated he was very careful in what he said.
But what was most interesting to me was that he repeated the fact that the club and the club doctor has ensured the program was ok.
This was certainly very carefully worded. He must of said it altleast 3 times.
This is why I think it wasn't necessarily good for the bombers because he basically pointed the finger right back at both the club and the club doctor (Bruce Reid).
I think he's getting on the front foot here and it wouldn't suprise me if the Watsons went all the way with this to clear Jobe of any responsibility.
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #695 on: June 25, 2013, 08:50:25 PM »

Whatever happens it was a very foolish thing for Jobe to say on live TV

I'm not sure if it matters WP.  I reckon by Jobe's comments last night that he has likely been just as honest and forthright in his interview with ASADA and would have told them the exact same thing, so to publicly say it now will have no further impact on what is already going to happen.  Just mho.

By foolish I mean the stir/firestorm it was always going to create.

The headlines, the talkback, Father Tim giving his views (he should SU IMO), the media camped outside Jobe's front door waiting for him to appear and then his "1 minute comment" this arvo

No need for it, pretty sure it wasn't what the EFC wanted

Fair enough.   :thumbsup

Offline Penelope

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #696 on: June 25, 2013, 09:13:55 PM »
I just watched the On The Couch replay of Jobe Watson's interview.  It appeared to me that it was a very carefully scripted set of questions and answers.  Neither Healy, nor Milhouse, nor Roos showed any shock about Jobe's admission.  There were no follow up questions nor any probing.  Watson's answers seemed to quite contrived and carefully phrased in legalese.

I can't work out why Jobe and his legal advisers determined that it would be beneficial to fess up last night, but if anyone is claiming that it was an off-th-cuff set of questions and answers, then I've got some shares in a bridge that I'd like to sell them.



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Offline one-eyed

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #697 on: June 25, 2013, 10:01:43 PM »
How the Bombers might argue their case
By Peter Ryan
6:46pm AEST Tuesday, June 25, 2013



LEADING sports lawyer Paul Horvath says Essendon players may still be able to frame a solid defence if the ASADA investigation finds they took banned substances during 2012.
 
Horvath said although Essendon skipper Jobe Watson's revelation on Fox Footy's On the Couch that he believed he had taken AOD-9604 in 2012 was stark, the Bombers may raise plausible arguments to mitigate the players' culpability.
 
He said one possible defence was that an Essendon representative or the distributor of the product may have a letter from the Therapeutic Goods Administration [or other government agency] stating that the drug was not banned or unfit for human use and therefore did not sit within WADA's catch-all S.0 category.

A second defence that might be raised according to Horvath was that the ACC report released in February stated on four occasions that AOD-9604 was not banned at the time. He said the developers of that report would have been getting their advice from ASADA.
 
"Even at the highest level of government, people that had six or nine months to put their very important, very careful report together got it wrong, so how can other people not be forgiven for getting it wrong if the substance was banned when used?" Horvath said.
 
Making the point that he was speculating based on publicly available information, Horvath said that although Watson's public statement was a surprise, he was presumably just telling the interviewer what he had told investigators.
 
Despite WADA releasing a statement in April confirming that AOD-9604 was banned because it fell into the S.0 category as it was still under pre-clinical and clinical development and had not been approved for therapeutic use by any government health authority in the world, many industry insiders have admitted since the Essendon revelations there was confusion as to its status.
 
However, athletes understand that the WADA code carries a strong strict liability principle that makes players liable for any substance that enters their body.

Watson's admission came on the same evening as the Australian Sports Anti-Doping Authority Amendment Bill 2013 passed through the Senate to move a step closer to giving ASADA the power to compel individuals to produce documents and materials relating to an anti-doping investigation.

The bill needs to pass through the House of Representatives to become law, with hopes it will proceed on Wednesday.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-06-25/how-the-dons-might-argue-their-case

Offline tigs2011

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #698 on: June 25, 2013, 10:57:22 PM »
I hope they don't get banned until after round 23. I want to beat their full team and call out cheats and boo every player that touches the ball.  :shh

Offline Yeahright

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #699 on: June 25, 2013, 11:53:17 PM »
How can a substance banned under the S0 rule not have been banned before? Silly arguement

Offline one-eyed

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #700 on: June 26, 2013, 02:24:22 AM »
Watson had been briefed by the Bombers and by his management not to answer any questions pertaining to the drugs scandal prior to going on 'On The Couch' on Monday night.

Watson's honesty took hold. Pushed, Watson said he signed the consent form, which listed AOD9604, and his belief was that he took it and that it was approved for consumption.

Read more at: http://www.news.com.au/national-news/victoria/bombers-sinking-in-muddied-pool-of-drugs-scandal/story-fnii5sms-1226669748162




FORMER ASADA boss Richard Ings says he could not see how Jobe Watson and possibly other Essendon players could escape an anti-doping tribunal hearing following Watson's admission he believed he took AOD9604.

Read more at: http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/former-asada-boss-richard-ings-says-charges-against-essendon-players-appear-to-be-a-sure-thing/story-fndv8gad-1226669748810




THE world anti-doping boss has laid down the law to crisis-hit Essendon, declaring: "The moment it's in your system, you're gone, full stop."

As the Bombers were in damage control yesterday, World Anti-Doping Agency president John Fahey told the Herald Sun that there were no "ifs or buts" about banned substances.

'If it's in your system, you're gone'

"Ninety-five per cent of athletes blame someone else," Mr Fahey said.

"There's strict liability here ... if it's in your system, you take the consequences."

Read more at: http://www.news.com.au/national-news/victoria/w/story-fnii5sms-1226669739324#mm-breached

Offline Judge Roughneck

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #701 on: June 26, 2013, 08:31:56 AM »
Not quite the rocket scientist is our jobe :shh

Offline Tigeritis™©®

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #702 on: June 26, 2013, 08:36:02 AM »
Not quite the rocket scientist is our jobe :shh
He'll take it to court. Lock it in.
Wouldn't be suprised if the players put in a class action against the club if they get banned.

Either way the bummers are screwed.  :clapping
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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #703 on: June 26, 2013, 08:37:10 AM »
Robbo has finally understood his club is stuffed. Rohan Connelly is still hoping  ;D

Offline Tigeritis™©®

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Re: Essendon face AFL probe
« Reply #704 on: June 26, 2013, 09:16:25 AM »
James Hird having a press conference at 9:30am.

Lets hope he does the honorable thing and stands himself down.  :pray
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