Author Topic: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]  (Read 14035 times)

Offline Andyy

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #45 on: April 01, 2022, 12:25:37 AM »
Not hard to see why the recruitment policy changed to include a players character
good to see a guy who played injured and was one of very few half decent players we had back then get slagged off . Probably the hardest player we had at the time  :lol

Average player, had a few good games at best.

Nobody told him to jump off a cliff.

Offline Assange Tiger 😎

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #46 on: April 01, 2022, 01:21:12 AM »
Was a good player. Surely it doesn't take a crystal ball to see he was also poorly managed. Mr death has a few victims too
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Offline camboon

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #47 on: April 01, 2022, 12:41:20 PM »
If he was one of our better players it explain how bad we were. I didn’t think he was much better than average at best and a bloke who seem to argue with just about anyone.
He is not the only one in that era who got a concussion and who played for multi clubs but he is one of the only ones I know of who is targeting his club.
This should be an AFL wise issue as they were that governing body who set the rules.

Offline Assange Tiger 😎

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #48 on: April 01, 2022, 01:36:31 PM »
Have you even read, listened or done any research here, camboon? The blokes back was shot as a result of playing hurt + a pre-season camp, and we were pumping him full of drugs to get him up for games..why? Because he was an average at best player? You can't have it both ways. He was pretty important to our backline. Sure he was a headache but he was good for us in the early 2000s.

I think it's a worse look if he was a dud yet we still injected him on 20 odd occasions with a crook back.
I work in Africa and they were taking the pee out of me for saving Africa.......
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Offline Andyy

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #49 on: April 01, 2022, 01:43:25 PM »
He was no Coughlan or N G Brown lol

He was a decent player at best and it speaks to how doggy door we were at the time.

Regardless his claim is bollocks IMO given that he was playing football well beyond AFL years.

Offline Assange Tiger 😎

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #50 on: April 01, 2022, 02:08:51 PM »
All we had back then was the enjoyment of watching the very few blokes that could play to an extent or were hard as nails.

I work in Africa and they were taking the pee out of me for saving Africa.......
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Offline Rampsation

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #51 on: April 01, 2022, 02:24:13 PM »
All we had back then was the enjoyment of watching the very few blokes that could play to an extent or were hard as nails.

It seems like he is a mate of yours and your loyalty to mate is commendable and honorable but if he was stuffed as you say how did he play on for years after he left Richmond. He must have passed a medical before Essendon recruited him and played him, he must have passed tests at all the country clubs he played for. The story doesnt stack up for mine, if he was knackered at Richmond then Essendon wouldnt have taken him and he wouldnt have been able to play country footy either. It doesnt stack up. Im sorry but it doesnt.

Offline JP Tiger

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #52 on: April 01, 2022, 03:01:33 PM »
"Did it end your football career?" 
"No your Honour, it didn't."

"Case dismissed!" ... *clonk!     ::)   
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Offline Assange Tiger 😎

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #53 on: April 01, 2022, 03:39:29 PM »
All we had back then was the enjoyment of watching the very few blokes that could play to an extent or were hard as nails.

It seems like he is a mate of yours and your loyalty to mate is commendable and honorable but if he was stuffed as you say how did he play on for years after he left Richmond. He must have passed a medical before Essendon recruited him and played him, he must have passed tests at all the country clubs he played for. The story doesnt stack up for mine, if he was knackered at Richmond then Essendon wouldnt have taken him and he wouldnt have been able to play country footy either. It doesnt stack up. Im sorry but it doesnt.
Understand what you're saying, but there is a difference between sitting in the square for Tourquay and playing AFL footy. I dont know if his case will get up, I doubt it well, but the club did have a duty of care surely and they definitely didn't manage his injuries well. Surely that's the main thing here whether or not he wins or loses? You want your club looking after blokes, not pumping blokes with injections non-stop. That's Essendon not Richmond
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Offline Rampsation

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #54 on: April 01, 2022, 05:22:18 PM »
If I was him, Id offer to withdraw the case if Richmond give me (him) a job as a scout or something of Junior talent for the womens program. He could stay in footy earn a fair salary and Richmond wouldnt have this law suit over its head. Everyone wins. Thats what I would do but thats just me. Even he doesnt want that then he can take his chances in court and if he loses hes gonna have to pay Richmonds legal fees on top of his own.

Offline camboon

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #55 on: April 01, 2022, 07:09:46 PM »
I did my research which may be the problem. Football clubs don’t force people to take injections you have a choice. I played with injection in my last year to play finals which wouldn’t be his reason, was it for money .
He has an issue with people who were at the club at the time and the rules that allowed  it to happen.
I get that ,but that was nothing to do with the majority of people at the now and the culture that doesn’t play injured players as a rule.
Sue the people and the AFL would make more sense to me.

Offline one-eyed

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Emotional Zantuck claims Tigers got treatment ‘horribly wrong’ (Age)
« Reply #56 on: April 01, 2022, 08:32:36 PM »
Emotional Zantuck claims Tigers got treatment ‘horribly wrong’

Jon Pierik
The Age
April 1, 2022 — 7.17pm


Former Richmond Football Club player Ty Zantuck was almost in tears on a day he told a court he believed the Tigers had got his medical treatment for a debilitating back injury “horribly wrong” but he faces a fight to have his case proceed.

Two days of cross-examination before Associate Justice Mary-Jane Ierodiaconou concluded in the Victorian Supreme Court on Friday, with Zantuck suing the club and two doctors, current club doctor Greg Hickey and former club doctor Chris Bradshaw, over allegations they breached their duty of care in the treatment of his back injury, when he played in 68 matches for the Tigers between 2000 and 2004.

Zantuck’s lawyer Lachlan Armstrong QC is arguing for an extension to be granted to the statute of limitations for bringing a civil claim.

In his writ, Zantuck, 40, claims doctors gave him more than 20 epidural injections to ease the pain and to keep training and playing, and that the club forced him to take part in a pre-season training camp which exacerbated his condition.

His lawyers also told the court that Zantuck had endured several concussions, leaving him with brain trauma. Zantuck has previously spoken of the suicidal thoughts he had.

Asked about a text message he claims he sent Dr Hickey of the “horrible feelings” he had about the Tigers’ Punt Rd home base, Zantuck said on Friday: “Just the treatment there, I wanted to be clear of there, and even … where the street where Victoria House is on, I still get goose bumps, anytime I go around there.”

The details of that alleged text message are also in dispute. Zantuck had epidural injections at Victoria House.

“I still love the Richmond Football Club, my two sons barrack for them. I just think they got the treatment horribly wrong,” Zantuck told the court via video evidence as he has contracted COVID-19.

He spent 2005 at Essendon where the court was told on Thursday that the Bombers refused to administer the epidural injections, prompting Zantuck to believe the Tigers had mistreated him. Zantuck’s AFL career ended after a fortnight of pre-season training at Carlton in 2006.

He sought to play community football as he needed the sign-on fees and match payments but he says his physical condition meant he couldn’t cope.

“I couldn’t (hold) down a job anywhere, I wasn’t able to drive, I was certainly medicated. I was just finding it hard to live any sort of life,” Zantuck, tears appearing to well in his eyes, said.

“I tried to get everything I could just to buy some food.”

The court also heard Zantuck had met with law firm Slater and Gordon for a consultation but Slater and Gordon told him they would not accept his case, with Zantuck on Thursday claiming the firm had said it was “too hard, too lengthy and too expensive to go up against the AFL”.

Lawyer Neill Murdoch, representing Dr Bradshaw, argues Zantuck’s claims may not be as clear as the former player has said. The defendants do not want Zantuck to be treated as a “reliable” witness because of the alleged different “accounts” of events he has given.

This included a Slater and Gordon letter of 2012, which says Zantuck had “three to four injections”, which the defence argues is “very much less” than what Zantuck now claims. However, Zantuck argues that not all medical records are available to the court.

All parties agree there are medical records which have been lost or are “scant” although there is an argument over why that is the case, including why Dr Bradshaw allegedly did not always keep detailed records of injections at training.

The defendants have questioned why it took until 2012 for Zantuck to meet with Slater and Gordon, and until April last year to launch civil action against his former club seeking damages.

Zantuck says he didn’t have the funds to pursue the case earlier but the defendants have questioned why there has been a “a 17-or-18-year delay” since he left the Tigers, with this impacting on the legal limitation period. However, Zantuck’s lawyers say his case only became clear when he was diagnosed with traumatic encephalopathy syndrome (TES) - “a ticking time bomb” - last year. TES suggests he has chronic traumatic encephalopathy, a degenerative brain disease.

Zantuck’s concussion case is only against the Tigers, and not specifically Dr Bradshaw and Dr Hickey.

The defendants, including Dr Hickey’s lawyer, say the deaths of three potential witnesses since Zantuck left the Tigers and Bombers, including former Tigers coach Danny Frawley and former Essendon club doctor Bruce Reid, could impact any further hearing, with their evidence “irreplaceable”.

The court was told on Thursday that the Tigers didn’t have a system for properly managing head injuries at the time. After closing arguments on Friday, all parties were offered the chance to head to mediation on April 8.

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/emotional-zantuck-claims-tigers-got-treatment-horribly-wrong-20220401-p5aa29.html

Offline Tigeritis™©®

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Re: Ex-Tiger Ty Zantuck’s damages claim [merged]
« Reply #57 on: April 02, 2022, 06:20:38 PM »
If his back was so bad how did he play games with Essendrugs?

So he couldn’t buy food to eat so he continued to play footy so he could eat?

Why didn’t his old man help him out?
The club that keeps giving.

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The club that keeps giving.

Offline one-eyed

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‘Medical staff were excluded’: Zantuck case reveals why Tigers’ doctor quit

Jon Pierik
The Age
February 22, 2023 — 4.25pm


A former Richmond Football Club doctor claims he quit the Tigers after medical staff were excluded from a pre-season training camp where former player Ty Zantuck alleges he was ordered to carry a 30-kilogram backpack despite having stress fractures in his lower back.

Former Richmond doctor Chris Bradshaw’s declaration was quoted as part of a landmark case in the Victorian Supreme Court brought against the Tigers and club doctors Greg Hickey and Bradshaw.

Zantuck alleges the club breached its duty of care in the treatment and management of his back injury when he played in 68 matches for the Tigers between 2000 and 2004.

Zantuck has also taken action against the club alone in relation to brain trauma while playing.

In an email by Bradshaw to Zantuck’s solicitors, and quoted by Associate Justice Mary-Jane Ierodiaconou in her 49-page summation of why Zantuck had successfully been granted extra time to pursue his case, Bradshaw said the handling of the 2004 club camp to the Grampians had prompted him to leave.

It was on this camp that Zantuck alleges, having earlier been diagnosed by Bradshaw with two stress fractures in his lower back, and having failed in his bid to sit out the training camp, he was initially ordered to carry a 30-kilogram backpack on daily hikes. This weight was later reduced to 15-20 kilograms after he complained again of back pain.

In his writ, Zantuck, 40, claims doctors gave him more than 20 epidural injections to ease his back pain and to keep training and playing, but Bradshaw and fellow club doctor Greg Hickey have denied they provided epidural injections.

In a May 17, 2021 email, Bradshaw wrote: “As a doctor all I ever wanted to do was to assist the athlete to achieve what they said they wanted. I would do so safely. I would never do a procedure without the athlete’s consent (it’s very hard to inject someone that’s struggling).

“I don’t deny that the camp at the Grampians made him sore … but the medical staff were excluded from that camp and had no input. It was very frustrating and ultimately caused me to leave the club because I felt the conditioning staff were putting players at risk without our input. We did everything we could to help the players and nothing to hurt them in the short or long term.”

In late January 2004, it was reported in The Age that Bradshaw had left to take up a position with English Premier League club Fulham.

“It’s quite a good time for both [clubs],” Bradshaw, who had been with the Tigers for 12 years, said at the time. “Fulham has been without a club doctor since the start of the year, and it wouldn’t have been fair to Richmond to get too far into the regular season before departing.”

Zantuck alleges he was given injections in his back to “play numb”, a claim Hickey and Bradshaw deny. Zantuck and Hickey are at odds over a text Zantuck allegedly sent to Hickey about 16 years ago seeking access to his medical records.

“He has effectively had his life crippled by his back injury,” Associate Justice Ierodiaconou wrote.

Associate Justice Ierodiaconou added: “RFC, Dr Bradshaw, and Dr Hickey each filed a defence to Mr Zantuck’s first statement of claim. By these defences, it is evident that the defendants contest Mr Zantuck’s back injury and treatment claims.”

Hickey found Zantuck’s medical records of 2004, but “it appears from a review of those medical records that no written evidence was kept in regards to the injections administered or prescribed by RFC’s doctors. If medical records are missing, then it is not the fault of Mr Zantuck.”

Having filed his initial writ and statement about his back injury in April 2021, Zantuck amended his claim in March 2022, to include “a brain injury arising from concussions”. The brain injury claim is only against the Tigers, although the club says it could yet extend to Bradshaw.

Zantuck’s lawyers, from Griffin Lawyers, have used video evidence of several clashes from 29 games, leading to claims of multiple concussions and brain trauma involving a degenerative disease. Zantuck has previously spoken of having had suicidal thoughts.

Associate Justice Ierodiaconou wrote that “the footage of RFC’s handling of other concussion incidents involving other players is likely to be relevant and highly probative of the absence of a good protocol for managing concussion”.

“The video evidence will show that Mr Zantuck’s experience was similar to other players. It will show how RFC dealt with events that are assessed by medical experts as concussions. There is no evidence from any of the defendants that positively asserts or even suggests that RFC had a concussion management protocol in place at the time. There are just a couple of weekly notes,” Associate Justice Ierodiaconou said in her summation.

“The allegation against RFC in respect of the concussion claim is that it did not have adequate systems or policies for dealing with head injuries. RFC has not provided any evidence as to whether or not it has relevant documentary evidence.”

The AFL and Tigers did not wish to comment. The AFL’s concussion and health-and-safety protocols are now among the world’s best.

Reports by neurologist Dr Rowena Mobbs and neuropsychologist associate professor Jennifer Batchelor “identified the existence of criteria for suspected traumatic encephalopathy syndrome (‘TES’) and evidence of acquired cognitive impairment. TES is the ‘in life’ correlate of chronic traumatic encephalopathy (‘CTE’). The expert scientific evidence is that detectable symptoms generally only emerge later in a person’s life when concussion injuries are sustained in their 20s.”

The defendants argued the deaths of Danny Frawley, coach at the time, and Tigers physiotherapist Ian Macindoe, and former Essendon club doctor Bruce Reid should have led to Zantuck’s case for extra time being denied as their evidence was critical.

A post-mediation directions hearing has been scheduled for April 21, with a trial set to begin on July 17.

Zantuck spent 2005 at Essendon, claiming in court last year that the Bombers refused to administer the epidural injections, prompting him to believe the Tigers had mistreated him. Zantuck’s AFL career ended after a fortnight of pre-season training at Carlton in 2006.

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/medical-staff-were-excluded-zantuck-case-reveals-why-tigers-doctor-quit-20230221-p5cmde.html